[quote author=robinhood link=topic=39272.msg1068595#msg1068595 date=1268418840]
Most of the time he's been here, he's played his 4231 formation, tried as often as possible to play Gerrard in the middle of that "3" and regularly played slow or not really appropriate strikers on the right and crap like that.
It just doesn't work for a whole bunch of reasons.
Obviously Torres and Mascherano, Reina and a few others are truly great signings, and until recently, he'd done amazing things defensively so we were near impossible to beat (apart from set pieces - under Rafa we've *always* conceded silly goals from set pieces, sometimes costing us valuable points at the top of the table).
And whilst we had Alonso, it did make sense to utilise Gerrard elsewhere, as they would try to do a lot of the same stuff whilst playing next to each other in CM. The only thing about this is that he didn't honestly need Alonso in the first place.
But - the season that Gerrard scored the most goals he's ever scored, despite what Rafa says about him playing mostly on the right, I rememberdoing my research, and more than half of the goals Gerrard scored were when he was playing in CM (not in the middle or to the right of the "3", but in CM, bursting forward).
Rafa's problem with Gerrard playing in CM is that he doesn't *like* him busting forward, because he believes in having two DMs, one to hold and playmake, and one to break up the opposition's play, or something to this effect - ie no Gerrard because he's not a good boy and doesn't shackle himself to the half-way line.
I don't agree with this - surely most people don't - not when we've got a world-class box-to-box midfielder in the squad. It's pointless. You have to set out the team to play to the players' strengths. I am certain that Rafa's desire to shoe-horn players into positions that don't fit them is the main reason why we lack cutting edge in the final third.
What is Kuyt doing on the RW? What is Gerrard doing at support striker? Strikers on the wings and a CM at support striker? It's mental.
Obviously you can get away with a *certain amount* of this, but when you get one or two key players injured, immediately your team appears to be a shambles if you're doing it in almost every attacking position.
Like I say, the main problem for me is that we lack any cutting edge in the final third. It was very telling last night to see Torres creating half-chances for Gerrard - there's only so much I can say about this because people get upset, but Gerrard and Liverpool FC would be better off if Gerrard could play in his natural box-to-box CM position.
He needs to go back into CM to partner Mascherano - this will give us creativity from deeper - as it is clear Gerrard can do an excellent job from here, despite the fact that Benitez has always been scared of letting him do it - we need to play midfielders in wide positions and strikers up front.
I reckon at the moment we'd be much better trying something like this:
--------Torres Babel
Aquilani Gerrard Mascher Johnson
Insua Agger Carragher Degen
------------Reina
Justification being, Johnson would clearly be good in a wide midfield position - or at least worth a try - Aquilani is left footed and I think he's played a bit on the left before. Alternatives being Riera and Benayoun.
Obviously Babel would be pretty interchangeable with Kuyt, but either of them will clearly perform better and more happily in striker roles.
But we aren't going to do anything like this. We're going to keep playing people in the wrong positions and there'll be NO CREATIVITY WHATSOEVER and we won't even make 5th place in the league.
[/quote]
Interesting thread Robin.
Re the 'Gerrard box-to-box' midfielder, I'm going to take umbrage.
Here's something for you; the days of box-box midfielders are over. They don't really exist anymore. You get the odd (very odd) exception depending upon the tactics, formation and state of the scoreline, but for the most part - there's no such thing as a box-to-box midfielder anymore.
Why?
Well, teams, sorry midfield exist of defensive midfielders or attacking midfielders. Two lines/levels/rows, whatever the fuck you want to call it. Makelele/Obi Mikel/Carrick/Palacios in one, Gerrard/Lampard/Cahill in the other. Some players can play in both areas like Fletcher, Anderson, Essien and occassionally and randomly the manager will try and shoe-horn a specialist in one of the bands into the other - like Fergsuon did when he deployed Carrick in the fucking hole behind Berbatov away to Wolves two weeks ago. It didn't work not unsrurprisingly.
Anyway, the reasons for this are endless; defensive solidity as you alluded to in some part, looking to gain control of the game, springboard for counter-attacks, but the most significant reasonf or the death of the box-to-box is the pace of the game these days. 10/20 years ago Keane, Ince, Robson, Vieira could do the role becasue they had the engine to do so, they played in formations (4-4-2) that enabled them to do so, but most importantly - the game wasn't as fast as it is now. David Batty was a specialist holding midfielder 15 years ago, there are 700 of him in the Premier League these days.
Anyway, Gerrard. He's done as a central midfielder in my opinion. He plays in bursts. He's brilliant in those bursts, and still takes up positions on the ground to receive the ball that others wouldn't think of. He's great going forward, actually better than that really, and in my opinion again - prefers scoring and setting up goals to any other part of the game. He looks like he's enjoyed the last 2/3 years of his career. To me, he plays at fucking maximum level in short brilliant bursts, and if you moved him into a role like central midfield you'd take that away from him, because he'd have to curtail his game and play at a more even level for 90 minutes. After watching Wigan away I'm not sure if he wants to do that to be honest. Besides, we know he's brilliant in that AM role, so I don't see a reason to change it. I've said for some time that he needs better players around him - on the right of that attacking triumverate, the left, in front, behind, wherever. But he needs better players there to take the onus off him to win games for us.
And finally; if you revert back to a 4-4-2, we'll get murdered on the flanks by sides with attacking full-backs. Murdered. We'd be effectively giving Evra, Cole, Sagna, and whomever else the freedom of the ground and no direct opponent. Good sides could and would beat us. Against shite sides, you could go with it sure, and for the odd surprise factor of deploying it (similar to what Brimingham did when they came to Anfield a few months back) - but for the most part - there's a reason why Managers don't play it.
