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Rafa Rafael

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Gary25

Gary25

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Those Liverpool fans who still love the man don't let anyone ever, ever talk badly of this genius. There's a generation Liverpool fans who owe the best night of their Liverpool supporting lives to that man. That great man.
To put things into context, and this is probably grossly unfair on Klopp for loads of reasons (Im still behind him all the way despite being pissed off with him over certain things) Rafa had a European Cup, an FA Cup and amassed 82 League points in a season at the stage Klopp is now.

Rafa wasn't perfect, he made some mistakes but it's that old saying you don't know what you have until it's gone. Well look at how we've done since Rafa left...a coincidence? I think not.

Long live King Rafa.
 
Without a doubt that night is the best night of my life. The roof came off the pub. I hugged and gyrated with strangers. But it was one match. One in a million. There's a reason why people call it "the miracle of Istanbul" Many thought it would never be recreated. Truth is, we've seen many marvels since. It goes down in history and we move on. Rafa is part of that history. He could have etched his name into history amongst peers like Shankly, Paisley et all but he lost the fucking plot towards the end. Plain and simple. Liverpool is just as much a poisoned chalice as the United job, if not more so. I'm grateful we have Klopp but it would take a sugar daddy/miracle for us to win the league. Rafa or no Rafa.
 
Rafa won everlasting love from most fans after the miracle at Istanbul.

I'm not convinced that overall, he took the club forward significantly during his term in office. He was clumsy in the way he handled our star players, he frittered away a lot of money on unsuccessful signings, and I didn't like his way of negotiating with the management via the back pages of the tabloids.

As a person, I think Rafa is a nice guy though.
 
I (grammar experts - Do I need to put a comma or a semicolon after the 'I' Here?) for one love the guy. He was brilliant for us and brought many happy memories. Made a few mistakes but overall he was sound. He also clearly loved the club. What more can you ask for?
 
Modo said:
Well we've won tons since he left, right?
Click to expand...

How many 1st division leagues, cups etc (i guess you'll want to charity shield/super cups?) has he won since he left us?

He gave us Istanbul and an amazing FA Cup final.
He should be applauded every time he comes to Anfield.
He is a really good human being, and his work in the city should be commended.
 
Portly said:
That's not relevant. Would we have won anything had Rafa stayed?

I doubt it.
Click to expand...
Difficult to say, but if he was being backed by the board like Klopp is, he would have been able to rebuild again.
If we look at who's won more trophies since he left, Rafa is comfortably in the lead.
 
Last edited:
Modo said:
Difficult to say, but if he was being backed by the board like Klopp is being backed, he would have been able to rebuild again.
If we look at whose won more trophies since he left, Rafa is comfortably in the lead.
Click to expand...

By 1 no?
 
LeTallecWiz said:
How many 1st division leagues, cups etc (i guess you'll want to charity shield/super cups?) has he won since he left us?

He gave us Istanbul and an amazing FA Cup final.
He should be applauded every time he comes to Anfield.
He is a really good human being, and his work in the city should be commended.
Click to expand...
2.
Europa League and Italian Cup.
Won the Championship as well. That's a league, no.
Minor cups? Like the Super cup? A few.
Point is, he usually wins finals.
 
Gary25 said:
To put things into context, and this is probably grossly unfair on Klopp for loads of reasons (Im still behind him all the way despite being pissed off with him over certain things) Rafa had a European Cup, an FA Cup and amassed 82 League points in a season at the stage Klopp is now.
Click to expand...

Yep, that period was Peak Rafa. He really got the most out of the players he had. Having said that though what trophies would Rafa have won without Gerrard?

Klopp's the first Liverpool manager in the PL era to not have a player of that quality. Evans had God, Ged had Owen, Rafa had Stevie and Rodgers had Suarez.

Mane and Coutihno are fine footballers but those players were on a different planet.
 
Tinto said:
Yep, that period was Peak Rafa. He really got the most out of the players he had. Having said that though what trophies would Rafa have won without Gerrard?

Klopp's the first Liverpool manager in the PL era to not have a player of that quality. Evans had God, Ged had Owen, Rafa had Stevie and Rodgers had Suarez.

Mane and Coutihno are fine footballers but those players were on a different planet.
Click to expand...
He would have won the league twice and the Uefa cup.
 
On the subject of 2005 I'm forever conflicted, like some character in a US tv show experiencing alternative universes. On the one hand, as someone lucky enough to have seen us win the European Cup on merit, winning because we were the best, it was painful to see us win another with such a mediocre side through the lottery of penalties. I shun most of the nostalgia for that night for that reason. But then on the other hand - bloody hell, we won it!

As for Rafa, 2005 was, I think, one of the great managerial performances there's ever been - I don't just mean the final, but also, and more importantly, the entire campaign. The way he stood like an orchestra leader and somehow got that ragbag of players past each challenge was astonishing. You can often make a case for managers not making much, if any, difference, but not him, then.

And he always had his heart in the right place. We like our managers to be good men as well as good managers, and he deserves his status for being both.
 
Modo said:
Difficult to say, but if he was being backed by the board like Klopp is, he would have been able to rebuild again.
If we look at who's won more trophies since he left, Rafa is comfortably in the lead.
Click to expand...

He spent about £80m over his last two seasons, I'll consider Johnson a reasonable success for his longevity, but he was an inconsistent and unreliable defender. Rafa was his own worse enemy at times and it's what saw many fans lose patience with him, being so stubborn over all sorts of matters.

I'll bold the out and out successes:

[xtable=skin1]
{tbody}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Josemi{/td}
{td=@x14}Malaga{/td}
{td=@x14}£2,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}26 July 2004{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Antonio Nunez{/td}
{td=@x14}Real Madrid{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}17 August 2004{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Xabi Alonso{/td}
{td=@x14}Real Sociedad{/td}
{td=@x14}£10,700,000{/td}
{td=@x14}20 August 2004{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Luis Garcia{/td}
{td=@x14}Barcelona{/td}
{td=@x14}£6,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}20 August 2004{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Mauricio Pellegrino{/td}
{td=@x14}Valencia{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}5 January 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Fernando Morientes{/td}
{td=@x14}Real Madrid{/td}
{td=@x14}£6,300,000{/td}
{td=@x14}13 January 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Scott Carson{/td}
{td=@x14}Leeds{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}21 January 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Boudewijn Zenden{/td}
{td=@x14}Free Transfer{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}4 July 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Pepe Reina{/td}
{td=@x14}Villarreal{/td}
{td=@x14}£6,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}4 July 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Antonio Barragan{/td}
{td=@x14}Sevilla{/td}
{td=@x14}£240,000{/td}
{td=@x14}4 July 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Momo Sissoko{/td}
{td=@x14}Valencia{/td}
{td=@x14}£5,600,000{/td}
{td=@x14}14 July 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Peter Crouch{/td}
{td=@x14}Southampton{/td}
{td=@x14}£7,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}20 July 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Miki Roque{/td}
{td=@x14}Lleidav{/td}
{td=@x14}Unknown{/td}
{td=@x14}15 August 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Jack Hobbs{/td}
{td=@x14}Lincoln{/td}
{td=@x14}£150,000{/td}
{td=@x14}18 August 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Besian Idrizaj{/td}
{td=@x14}LASK Linz{/td}
{td=@x14}£190,000{/td}
{td=@x14}22 August 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Mark Gonzalez{/td}
{td=@x14}Albacete{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}20 October 2005{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Paul Anderson{/td}
{td=@x14}Hull{/td}
{td=@x14}Swap{/td}
{td=@x14}1 January 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Jan Kromkamp{/td}
{td=@x14}Villarreal{/td}
{td=@x14}Swap{/td}
{td=@x14}4 January 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}David Martin{/td}
{td=@x14}MK Dons{/td}
{td=@x14}£250,000{/td}
{td=@x14}12 January 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Daniel Agger{/td}
{td=@x14}Brondby{/td}
{td=@x14}£5,800,000{/td}
{td=@x14}12 January 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Robbie Fowler{/td}
{td=@x14}Man City{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}27 January 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Craig Bellamy{/td}
{td=@x14}Blackburn{/td}
{td=@x14}£6,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}1 July 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Gabriel Paletta{/td}
{td=@x14}Banfield{/td}
{td=@x14}£2,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}4 July 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Fabio Aurelio{/td}
{td=@x14}Valencia{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}5 July 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Jermaine Pennant{/td}
{td=@x14}Birmingham{/td}
{td=@x14}£6,700,000{/td}
{td=@x14}26 July 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Dirk Kuyt{/td}
{td=@x14}Feyenoord{/td}
{td=@x14}£9,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}18 August 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Nabil El Zhar{/td}
{td=@x14}St Etienne{/td}
{td=@x14}£200,000{/td}
{td=@x14}21 August 2006{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Astrit Ajdarevic{/td}
{td=@x14}Falkenberg{/td}
{td=@x14}£750,000{/td}
{td=@x14}11 January 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Daniele Padelli{/td}
{td=@x14}Sampdoria{/td}
{td=@x14}Loan{/td}
{td=@x14}12 January 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Jordy Brouwer{/td}
{td=@x14}Ajax{/td}
{td=@x14}Undisclosed{/td}
{td=@x14}24 January 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Francisco Manuel Duran{/td}
{td=@x14}Malaga{/td}
{td=@x14}£66,000{/td}
{td=@x14}30 January 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}Alvaro Arbeloa{/td}
{td}Deportivo{/td}
{td}£2,500,000{/td}
{td}31 January 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Javier Mascherano{/td}
{td=@x14}West Ham{/td}
{td=@x14}Loan{/td}
{td=@x14}20 February 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Lucas{/td}
{td=@x14}Gremio{/td}
{td=@x14}£5,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}11 May 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Krisztian Nemeth{/td}
{td=@x14}MTK Hungaria{/td}
{td=@x14}Undisclosed{/td}
{td=@x14}25 May 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Mikel San Jose{/td}
{td=@x14}Athletic Bilbao{/td}
{td=@x14}£270,000{/td}
{td=@x14}28 June 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Sebastian Leto{/td}
{td=@x14}Lanús{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,800,000{/td}
{td=@x14}1 July 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Fernando Torres{/td}
{td=@x14}Atletico Madrid{/td}
{td=@x14}£20,200,000{/td}
{td=@x14}4 July 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Andriy Voronin{/td}
{td=@x14}Leverkusen{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}6 July 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Yossi Benayoun{/td}
{td=@x14}West Ham{/td}
{td=@x14}£5,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}12 July 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Ryan Babel{/td}
{td=@x14}Ajax{/td}
{td=@x14}£11,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}13 July 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Charles Itandje{/td}
{td=@x14}Lens{/td}
{td=@x14}Undisclosed{/td}
{td=@x14}9 August 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Emiliano Insua{/td}
{td=@x14}Boca Juniors{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,300,000{/td}
{td=@x14}26 August 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Lauri Dalla Valle{/td}
{td=@x14}JIPPO{/td}
{td=@x14}£600,000{/td}
{td=@x14}8 November 2007{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Martin Skrtel{/td}
{td=@x14}Zenit St Petersburg{/td}
{td=@x14}£6,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}11 January 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Javier Mascherano{/td}
{td=@x14}Media Sports Investment{/td}
{td=@x14}£18,600,000{/td}
{td=@x14}29 February 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Philipp Degen{/td}
{td=@x14}Borussia Dortmund{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}3 July 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Andrea Dossena{/td}
{td=@x14}Udinese{/td}
{td=@x14}£7,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}4 July 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Diego Cavalieri{/td}
{td=@x14}Palmeiras{/td}
{td=@x14}£3,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}11 July 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}David N'Gog{/td}
{td=@x14}Paris St Germain{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}24 July 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Robbie Keane{/td}
{td=@x14}Tottenham{/td}
{td=@x14}£19,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}28 July 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Albert Riera{/td}
{td=@x14}Espanyol{/td}
{td=@x14}£8,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}31 August 2008{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Glen Johnson{/td}
{td=@x14}Portsmouth{/td}
{td=@x14}£17,500,000{/td}
{td=@x14}26 June 2009{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Alberto Aquilani{/td}
{td=@x14}Roma{/td}
{td=@x14}£17,100,000{/td}
{td=@x14}7 August 2009{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Sotirios Kyrgiakos{/td}
{td=@x14}AEK Athens{/td}
{td=@x14}£2,000,000{/td}
{td=@x14}21 August 2009{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Daniel Ayala{/td}
{td=@x14}Sevilla{/td}
{td=@x14}£160,000{/td}
{td=@x14}17 September 2009{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Maxi Rodriguez{/td}
{td=@x14}Atletico Madrid{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}12 January 2010{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Raheem Sterling{/td}
{td=@x14}Queens Park Rangers{/td}
{td=@x14}£600,000{/td}
{td=@x14}27 February 2010{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Jonjo Shelvey{/td}
{td=@x14}Charlton{/td}
{td=@x14}£1,700,000{/td}
{td=@x14}10 May 2010{/td}
{/tr}
{tr=@x14}
{td=@x14}Milan Jovanovic{/td}
{td=@x14}Standard Liege{/td}
{td=@x14}Free{/td}
{td=@x14}8 July 2010{/td}
{/tr}
{/tbody}
[/xtable]
 
Last edited:
Modo said:
Difficult to say, but if he was being backed by the board like Klopp is, he would have been able to rebuild again.
If we look at who's won more trophies since he left, Rafa is comfortably in the lead.
Click to expand...
I would imagine Rafa’s net spend was far higher than Klopp’s.
Klopp so far has NOT been backed. He’s been on positive net spend till this summer.
 
refugee said:
Love Rafa

I still can't believe that we replaced him with that cabbage.
Click to expand...

Yep, hopefully we've got the right manager now and the flaws we're seeing he will eventually be ironed out, so they don't become a weight around his neck that eventually sees him go under. If Klopp gets the defense sorted, then we're laughing.
 
Rafa really did buy some shite didn't he, that's not to say he didn't make good signing but the volume was incredible. He just loved signing squad players, that's one of my abiding memories of him, he was pathological tinkerer, and every new player was another variable to him.
 
RedStar said:
Rafa really did buy some shite didn't he, that's not to say he didn't make good signing but the volume was incredible. He just loved signing squad players, that's one of my abiding memories of him, he was pathological tinkerer, and every new player was another variable to him.
Click to expand...
I agree he did buy some shit. In his defence he was desperately trying to make the squad bigger with a small budget. At our best we almost had a world class XI with semi good squad players. Do you think he would have done the same if he was backed financially?
Also, some of those bargains worked out. Off the top of my head, Alonso for 10 mill, Garcia, Arbeloa, Agger, Skrtel.
Yeah he bought Johnson but remember that he originally wanted to sign Danny Alves. He wanted Jovetic, he wanted David Villa, Javi Martinez etc. Man if he was allowed to build like Mourinho for instance we could have had a dynasty by now.
Instead he was forced to fill 5 positions with like 20 mill, net spend.
 
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