Pre Match Thread - Chelsea (a) - Sun 13th 16:30
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The best thing about Trent playing in midfield is that he can't be a fucking liability at the back anymore.
But he is also not a midfielder, so back to right back is the move for me.
If Dreamy had started this thread Chilwell would have been onside and we would have lost.
A few points I noticed after watching at the pub and replays when I got home.
Gallagher was not amazing, he made a string of errors in that first 30 mins we dominated. He was good thereafter but that was a) maybe because he was getting used to the position and b) because Enzo started to run midfield.
We can lambast Klopp all we like for playing Gakpo in midfield but he's played there before and Jones was returning from an injury layoff. Elliott isn't an LCM (ever). In fact the system clearly worked (even though Gakpo was far from his best and should have been subbed at HT) for 30 mins.
In that vein if Jones had come on at HT we could *maybe* have stemmed the flow of crosses from James, by far their most dangerous player.
Trent was peripheral at best, though did do some good work in defence. Clearly he couldn't have played MF in that match, what was missing for us was a DM, which he isn't. And if we had a DM then he isn't the best choice in MF either because Szobo, Mac and the DM would be the first choice all day long.
It should be said that with that midfield he'd likely be far more involved than yesterday, although that still wouldn't excuse his terrible passing (for him).
Nunez got the 3rd loudest cheer of the day in the pub - he is clearly loved by the masses ! With Chelsea dominating possession for 45 mins before and after HT I'd have liked to see him given longer to have a go at Thiago in place of Jota who had a poor outing.
I thought it wrong to take Mo off : Nunez - Mo - Doak would have been good too (pity Doak didn't see much of the ball as Colwill was clearly lacking against pace and trickery). Mo was having a good game which is why I guess he was so upset.
Ibou was fucking awesome. Virgil was excellent all game too. Ali was Ali - brilliant.
Less said about Robbo the better. We need to be looking for another LB if this continues.
Overall I thought we were unlucky not to be maybe 3 up before they scored. Mo's disallowed goal seemed to be like a pin in a balloon to us - that is worrying. My Chelsea supporting mates who went to the match (and I met up with after) thought, for the first 30 mins, it was going to be 4 or 5-0.
A draw was a fair result on the balance of the quality of chances.
Gallagher was not amazing, he made a string of errors in that first 30 mins we dominated. He was good thereafter but that was a) maybe because he was getting used to the position and b) because Enzo started to run midfield.
We can lambast Klopp all we like for playing Gakpo in midfield but he's played there before and Jones was returning from an injury layoff. Elliott isn't an LCM (ever). In fact the system clearly worked (even though Gakpo was far from his best and should have been subbed at HT) for 30 mins.
In that vein if Jones had come on at HT we could *maybe* have stemmed the flow of crosses from James, by far their most dangerous player.
Trent was peripheral at best, though did do some good work in defence. Clearly he couldn't have played MF in that match, what was missing for us was a DM, which he isn't. And if we had a DM then he isn't the best choice in MF either because Szobo, Mac and the DM would be the first choice all day long.
It should be said that with that midfield he'd likely be far more involved than yesterday, although that still wouldn't excuse his terrible passing (for him).
Nunez got the 3rd loudest cheer of the day in the pub - he is clearly loved by the masses ! With Chelsea dominating possession for 45 mins before and after HT I'd have liked to see him given longer to have a go at Thiago in place of Jota who had a poor outing.
I thought it wrong to take Mo off : Nunez - Mo - Doak would have been good too (pity Doak didn't see much of the ball as Colwill was clearly lacking against pace and trickery). Mo was having a good game which is why I guess he was so upset.
Ibou was fucking awesome. Virgil was excellent all game too. Ali was Ali - brilliant.
Less said about Robbo the better. We need to be looking for another LB if this continues.
Overall I thought we were unlucky not to be maybe 3 up before they scored. Mo's disallowed goal seemed to be like a pin in a balloon to us - that is worrying. My Chelsea supporting mates who went to the match (and I met up with after) thought, for the first 30 mins, it was going to be 4 or 5-0.
A draw was a fair result on the balance of the quality of chances.
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Robbo's been poor for a couple of seasons now, he's definitely on the decline. I thought we played some great football, but we tired in the second half and let them into it when we should have been out of sight after 30-40 mins. Lots to be positive about, but our "holes" were as obvious as they've ever been.
He had a bad game yesterday, but he's been largely a success in that hybrid role. He ironically defended well yesterday when he had to get back and defend, it was him giving the ball away that was the issue, but we struggled with that as a team, our issue with being hit on the break was obvious. We need a defender and a DM.
Finally - thank you for just saying that. You really cannot have a cone in midfield like Trent in the hope that he produces one sublime pass to a front man who goes and scores. Honestly he does look completely lost at times now, and it seems like as a team both our need for a certain DM, and formation and other shit is all down to us trying to get that one pass per game out of him. No fucking team does that.
Great stat - I remember that Feb game against Man City - we beat them 4-3 didn't we ?
Not a fan of this thing Klopp has with playing 4 strikers. It's basically admitting the rest of the team is shit and we need to outscore teams. It doesn't work.
Gapko was poor, but so was Jota, either one of them should have made way for Jones or Elliott at half time. Harvey was brilliant when he came on, tbf.
Gapko was poor, but so was Jota, either one of them should have made way for Jones or Elliott at half time. Harvey was brilliant when he came on, tbf.
Agree on most of what you said, but I totally understand why Klopp took Salah off, he was not that active in the 2nd half.
Overall the result was fair, but again I must state - its a lost opportunity, I felt we had enough players with experience, compared to their line-up , and we should have beaten them regardless of past games/history etc. It's actually a terrible result for us against what I see as a team of kids.
Yeah I've been a critic but he was excellent yesterday.
Maybe he's realised that the whole idea of playing him in two positions at once is fucking insanely stupid.
This may sound a bit mad but if Thiago played yesterday we’d won easily.
RIP.
RIP.
I don't think so. The main thing that stuck out to me yesterday is that Chelsea are full of strong, quick athletes. And we are not. Thiago wouldn't have helped with that.
The idea that he's good in possession is fine and dandy but doesn't help if everyone else in the team is struggling.
Anyways, bit of a mess yesterday.
Alisson was fucking brilliant. Ibou and VVD also very good (bar a few chaotic moments). Mostly it made me dread the idea of an injury because we rely so much on the ability of Konate and to a lesser extent these days, VVD, to cover ground.
I liked Szobo as he was agressive and a strong runner but will need time to settle in and looked lost a lot of the time in what was a tough game.
Mac Allister is good but too often he turned into trouble and played poor passes (in one case, he played a 5 yard pass to a Chelsea player, got it back immediately and then played a shit pass again). Frustrating but all in all, very glad we got him.
Gakpo had some decent moments (largely involving a bit of Gini esque skill) but cannot play midfield in a game like this again. I don't know how Klopp ever saw this working.
TAA I thought was okay defensively. Passing was pretty poor on the whole though.
Robertson was fucking dreadful and another milestone performance on a general downturn that started a couple years ago. Wish we'd have signed someone like that Kerkez people were going on about.
Salah started the game really well and was then let down by the team as we couldn't get the ball to him. Can understand his disappointment but the tantrum was pretty embarassing (for him).
Jota, Diaz... standard stuff I guess. Good in parts, average in others.
Is this fair comment on Nunez yesterday? I fear it is
[hl]
The current standing of Liverpool’s second-most expensive signing ever can be gauged from the fact that they started the game with four forwards and none of them was him. On 68 minutes, with Chelsea now dominating, Darwin Núñez was eventually called from the bench. His first meaningful involvement was to drift to the right and attempt to form a triangle with Salah and Alexander-Arnold, a triangle with only two points as the other two didn’t seem interested in passing to him. Instead they dithered and moved backwards, Alexander-Arnold lost possession, and Nicolas Jackson was suddenly streaking through, only for Alisson to save one-on-one.
That near-miss may have been why Klopp took Salah off a couple of minutes later, but it would have been better to take Núñez off, even though he had only been on the pitch for seven minutes at that point.
His highlights in the remaining quarter hour: losing a 50-50 with the 39-year old Thiago Silva, stepping backwards when Dominik Szoboszlai wanted him to step forwards for a quick one-two, and miscontrolling Alexis Mac Allister’s quick forward pass when alone and unmarked in the Chelsea penalty area. Mac Allister’s pass wasn’t good, but Nuñez’s touch was worse.
At the very end he shouldered Malo Gusto to the ground, turned, ran and hit a 25-yard shot which deflected off Ugochukwu and wide.
It was a moment that showed the qualities that would make Núñez a good player for a bad team. With his power, speed and tunnel vision, he could be a phenomenal player for the current Everton side, or any slow defensive team that needs an out-ball to a game and speedy forward.
But Klopp’s Liverpool have always been about putting more and more pressure on the opponent until they buckle. Keeping the pressure on means keeping the ball in tight spaces, and this is where Nuñez struggles. With him in the side, no sooner are they threatening to build some pressure when along comes Núñez to let the air out. Unless he’s got secret admirers in Saudi Arabia, it’s looking like another awkward season in prospect.
[hl][/hl][/hl]
[hl]
The current standing of Liverpool’s second-most expensive signing ever can be gauged from the fact that they started the game with four forwards and none of them was him. On 68 minutes, with Chelsea now dominating, Darwin Núñez was eventually called from the bench. His first meaningful involvement was to drift to the right and attempt to form a triangle with Salah and Alexander-Arnold, a triangle with only two points as the other two didn’t seem interested in passing to him. Instead they dithered and moved backwards, Alexander-Arnold lost possession, and Nicolas Jackson was suddenly streaking through, only for Alisson to save one-on-one.
That near-miss may have been why Klopp took Salah off a couple of minutes later, but it would have been better to take Núñez off, even though he had only been on the pitch for seven minutes at that point.
His highlights in the remaining quarter hour: losing a 50-50 with the 39-year old Thiago Silva, stepping backwards when Dominik Szoboszlai wanted him to step forwards for a quick one-two, and miscontrolling Alexis Mac Allister’s quick forward pass when alone and unmarked in the Chelsea penalty area. Mac Allister’s pass wasn’t good, but Nuñez’s touch was worse.
At the very end he shouldered Malo Gusto to the ground, turned, ran and hit a 25-yard shot which deflected off Ugochukwu and wide.
It was a moment that showed the qualities that would make Núñez a good player for a bad team. With his power, speed and tunnel vision, he could be a phenomenal player for the current Everton side, or any slow defensive team that needs an out-ball to a game and speedy forward.
But Klopp’s Liverpool have always been about putting more and more pressure on the opponent until they buckle. Keeping the pressure on means keeping the ball in tight spaces, and this is where Nuñez struggles. With him in the side, no sooner are they threatening to build some pressure when along comes Núñez to let the air out. Unless he’s got secret admirers in Saudi Arabia, it’s looking like another awkward season in prospect.
[hl][/hl][/hl]
I have no idea why we bought him to be honest. You don't pay the money we paid for him then try to mould him into a player he is not. He is not on the same wavelength as any of our players. He will score a few goals here and there but we will never be able to consistently rely on him. He doesn't fit the way we play.
I'm still adamant Nunez will be fine. The bit they're highlighting there typifies salahs and Trent's game. He was there, and they fannied around with it
Something I wish we did in pre season was pick a front 3, and play them every game. Rotating like this means no one really finds a rhythm with their team mates. Especially new ones
Something I wish we did in pre season was pick a front 3, and play them every game. Rotating like this means no one really finds a rhythm with their team mates. Especially new ones
I think ideally the three are Diaz, Gapko and Salah, on paper at least it makes the most sense and is probably the closest we get to the Mane/Firm/Salah partnership of old. The issue is it relies on Diaz becoming a 20 goal striker, we'll get goals from the five of them, but if we played the more prolific three (Nunez, Salah and Jota) it's a set up that probably won't work well.
Poch may be the guy to bring out the best in him, doesn't change 2nd half of last season he was pretty average.
Should've been sent off for putting his head into Jota's face.
Cunt.
yeah, sadly we missed out, but we got mac, who is also very good
I agree that trip is the closest to the way we used to play, but Diaz is not, and will never be as good as mane.
So we need to adapt. If we're so adamant about keeping Trent at rb, and having more creativity in our cm, we should pile all our time in to consistently starting Nunez so he and the other can get on each others wavelengths. Hell, not even Nunez, play Jota as the 9. Our style needs to change
I think it’s Klopp’s preference for first teamers rather than specialists especially if they happen to be sprogs. We had that with Fabinho and Henderson at centre-half and with disastrous outcomes. He seems not to trust fringe players at all unless forced by circumstances.
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I thought Chelsea's main threat was Ben Chilwell. He was cutting us up. It was the wrong selection. Should have started with CJ in MF with Ali Mac and Dom and Nunez, Salah and Diaz upfront.
Salah should have stayed on when Nunez came on, they had a good preseason partnership
Salah should have stayed on when Nunez came on, they had a good preseason partnership
That's the thing it was Trent Vs Chilwell. Imagine if it was someone better, like a real winger.
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