Old Firm exit?

[Sunny]

[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959956#msg959956 date=1255012767]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=36335.msg959931#msg959931 date=1255011346]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=36335.msg959930#msg959930 date=1255011298]
I don't know why it's ok for Welsh clubs to play in England, but not Scottish ones.
[/quote]

It's not. Kick the druids out too. Let Cardiff play the likes of Barry Town and Merthyr Tydfil.
[/quote]

That won't be easy because they are members of the English FA, innit?
[/quote]

Er. Yes. That's correct. If they were historically part of it then they're entitled to be in it then.

 

[Holle]

Moreover if Berwick Rangers FC as an English club are allowed to play in Scotland sure the Glaswegians could use this to back their intentions?

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959969#msg959969 date=1255014056]
[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36335.msg959968#msg959968 date=1255013885]
[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959966#msg959966 date=1255013460]
Another question would be if both would be allowed to play in Europe even if they qualify. If I'm not mistaken the English FA refused to nominate Cardiff to play in Europe even if they should qualify.
[/quote]

I think they'd have to treat the teams as completely 'Anglicised' if they took them at all, and let results take their course - otherwise there would be too many questions raised as to what was going on. But as the Blatter quote above makes clear, FIFA is just waiting for a chance to cut the perceived 'British' bias internally, and anything like this would probably be deemed as far too risky.
[/quote]

But the EFA stated that they would not nominate Cardiff, even if they had beaten Pompey in the FA Cup Final.
[/quote]

I think that's because they're now uneasy about the historical anomaly. They used to be far more easygoing about such matters. I think I'm right in saying that Cardiff are technically 'guests' in the English Leagues, because they're now under the formal jurisdiction of the Welsh FA as absent participants. It's a real mess! So long as the whole 'quaint' matter remains such, FIFA can't be arsed to query it, but they don't want the anomaly to gain visibility by any of the teams winning anything and thus prompting other countries to start asking difficult questions.

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959972#msg959972 date=1255014643]
Moreover if Berwick Rangers FC as an English club are allowed to play in Scotland sure the Glaswegians could use this to back their intentions?
[/quote]

Yes, they could invite more English teams to join their league 🙂 I'm sure Barrow will bite their hands off at the offer.

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959972#msg959972 date=1255014643]
Moreover if Berwick Rangers FC as an English club are allowed to play in Scotland sure the Glaswegians could use this to back their intentions?
[/quote]

That's a really tricky one, because I think I'm right in saying that the area was never formally annexed by England and has a compilcated legal and political identity (or identities). There is a special dispensation FIFA can grant for any team - that Swiss one you mentioned earlier has one - but the bureacrats hate such things and so practically it would be unlikely.

 

[Holle]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36335.msg959973#msg959973 date=1255014691]
[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959969#msg959969 date=1255014056]
[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36335.msg959968#msg959968 date=1255013885]
[quote author=Doped White Mouse link=topic=36335.msg959966#msg959966 date=1255013460]
Another question would be if both would be allowed to play in Europe even if they qualify. If I'm not mistaken the English FA refused to nominate Cardiff to play in Europe even if they should qualify.
[/quote]

I think they'd have to treat the teams as completely 'Anglicised' if they took them at all, and let results take their course - otherwise there would be too many questions raised as to what was going on. But as the Blatter quote above makes clear, FIFA is just waiting for a chance to cut the perceived 'British' bias internally, and anything like this would probably be deemed as far too risky.
[/quote]

But the EFA stated that they would not nominate Cardiff, even if they had beaten Pompey in the FA Cup Final.
[/quote]

I think that's because they're now uneasy about the historical anomaly. They used to be far more easygoing about such matters. I think I'm right in saying that Cardiff are technically 'guests' in the English Leagues, because they're now under the formal jurisdiction of the Welsh FA as absent participants. It's a real mess! So long as the whole 'quaint' matter remains such, FIFA can't be arsed to query it, but they don't want the anomaly to gain visibility by any of the teams winning anything and thus prompting other countries to start asking difficult questions.
[/quote]

But FIFA already had to deal with such anomalies in the past. I don't think that the French clubs were happy when Monaco represented them in Europe.

 

[gkmacca]

Yes, but 'in the past'. They don't welcome being asked to do so again. I don't mean it's impossible, I'm just saying FIFA really, really wants to avoid such issues.

 

[Molbystwin]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36335.msg959965#msg959965 date=1255013431]
It's very much a political issue, primarily, I think. Whatever else is argued, the suits at the SFA will be desperate to cling on to their jobs and powers, and some in FIFA will be eager to diminish the British influence internationally. The Olympics debate showed where all of these ideas lead, sooner or later:

Blatter against British 2012 team
Fifa president Sepp Blatter says a Great Britain football team at the 2012 Olympic Games should feature only English players.

The Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish football bodies oppose a GB team in case it affects their Fifa status, while England back the idea.

Blatter now says said the independent status of the four British associations could be harmed by a unified GB team.

"They should enter only a team composed of players from England," said Blatter.

"This will then not provoke a long and endless discussion of the four British associations."


The International Olympic Committee does not recognise separate teams from Britain's home countries.

Olympic qualification has been impossible as it is based on Fifa's under-21 competitions in which the four home nations compete individually.

Blatter was speaking from Gleneagles, Scotland, where the International Football Association annual meeting has been taking place.

The Scottish FA reiterated its opposition to a unified team during a meeting with Blatter on Saturday.

"I said that is the best thing for you to do," said Blatter.

"If you start to put together a combined team for the Olympic Games, the question will automatically come up that there are four different associations so how can they play in one team.

"If this is the case then why the hell do they have four associations and four votes and their own vice-presidency?

"This will put into question all the privileges that the British associations have been given by the Congress in 1946."

Great Britain would have a men's team for the first time since the 1956 Olympics and a women's team for the first time ever.

Story from BBC SPORT:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/sport1/hi/olympics/football/7286011.stm

[/quote]

He really is a charmer that fella....


why the hell should they have four associations?? because historically we gave the game to the rest of Europe for one.....whats so hard to understand? Traditionally in Britain there have been independent football associations responsible for the local clubs to each country inside the union, extra importance, whatever that means, no doubt stems from these islands being the traditional birthplace of the sport. What does he want an apology for not setting it all up as he would want?? In olmypic sports however probably because it was set up by the french, we have competed jointly. Its all about FIFA wanting more and more power.

Whatver way you look at it it would be a shame if the whole nations favourite sport couldnt be represented at the olympics because of Blatters petty politics. I realise not everyone cares nor likes the idea but i think it would be great to have a squad at the olympics. Most of the players would probably be English anyway due the respective leagues, no football fan of either individual country would want to forego having their own national team for a one off tournament so why do FIFA have to put the associations in such a position??

Switzerland ... for gods sake....

 

[Buddha]

[quote author=Frogfish link=topic=36335.msg959909#msg959909 date=1255010154]
[quote author=Asim link=topic=36335.msg959893#msg959893 date=1255009744]
Why would they start at the bottom and potentially take 5+ years to get to the prem (if they were to get there) they would lose out on loads of money, no europe, how would they keep players happy while they are playing in Div 2
[/quote]

Are they talking about Div 2 or the mooted lower tier of a new two-tier PL league ?
[/quote]

The latter quite obviously.

 

[gkmacca]

Jack Warner makes Blatter seem a pussycat. This racist Mugabe mini me from trinidad and tobago has numerous big football associations running around trying to outdo each other in their arse-licking of this ridiculous crook. It's incredible.

(Info on Warner: http://www.mattkeefe.com/?tag=jack-warner)

 

[Squiggles]

Did you see Warner's 'dig' at England's bid to hold the World Cup in 2018?

The FA's response instantly made me think of that article you posted.

 

[gkmacca]

Yes, Warner never fails to amaze. How a FIFA boss can go around saying things like 'no one likes England,' when he's supposed to be impartial, is a mystery. I mean, you'd think there would at least be some effort to keep him under control. He practically forced England to go and play that friendly in Jamaica last year, and then complained that he didn't think they brought enough stars. What a tit.


He was exposed by Panorama a while ago as­ corrupt and using his position for financial gain. FIFA­ auditors Ernst & Young estimated that his family­ made a profit of at least $1 million from reselling­ 2006 World Cup tickets on the black market that Warner­ had ordered. Minutes of FIFA’s executive committee­ indicate that a fine of almost $1 million, equal to the­ expected profiteering, was imposed on the family, but, despite numerous reminders from FIFA, only $250,000 has­ been paid.

After Trinidad and Tobago visited Scotland­ for the friendly match in 2004, Warner asked the SFA President John McBeth­ for the cheque for the game to be made out to him­ personally and not the FA of Trinidad and Tobago! McBeth refused to issue the cheque to Warner. Warner­ also approached several members of staff at the­ Scottish Football Association in an attempt to get the­ money due to the T&T FA.

Following a deal to share­ the profits from the 2006 World Cup, Warner declared­ revenue of TT$18.25 million, costs of TT$17.9 million­ and offered the players a split of TT$5,644.08 per­ player. The Trinidad and Tobago government later­ revealed that the Federation received in excess of­ TT$173 million for their part in the tournament in­ Germany.

In a BBC interview about England's­ chances of holding the 2018 FIFA World Cup. He asserted­ that "England invented the sport but has never­ made any impact on world football" despite being­ one of only seven nations to ever lift the world cup,­ "England is an irritant", and that­ "Nobody in Europe likes England". Furthermore­ Warner proposed that, if the World Cup were to be held­ in Europe, it should be held in Italy, Spain, or France­ (countries that last hosted the competition in 1990,­ 1982 and 1998 respectively).

 

[Dreambeliever]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36335.msg959918#msg959918 date=1255010482]
Seeing as the Scottish FA is so paranoid about being classed as 'British' it refused to co-operate with the British Olympic team even after getting FIFA assurances it wouldn't have been penalised for doing so, letting its two biggest clubs join the English league looks a pretty risky venture. And more generally, a precedent would be set where, for example, Ajax might fancy playing in serie A, Lyon might ask to play in Spain - I mean, you either play in your own country's league, for better or worse, or everyone moves around to wherever they fancy.
[/quote]

Euro super league

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=36335.msg960182#msg960182 date=1255069823]
Euro super league
[/quote]

That seemed to be what the Rangers CEO was going on about.

The beginning of the end, perhaps?

 

[gkmacca]

It's probably their best/least worst chance, but all the blazers at all the various FAs would be mortified at how many faced the chop. It'd be like the decline of northern club land.

 

[Holle]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36335.msg960217#msg960217 date=1255078279]
It's probably their best/least worst chance, but all the blazers at all the various FAs would be mortified at how many faced the chop. It'd be like the decline of northern club land.
[/quote]

But they're both not even in the G 14. So it would be highly doubtful if they'd make it into such a league.

 

[gkmacca]

Yes, unlikely. But it's their least worse chance. I still don't see them having a serious chance of going anywhere. If they try, FIFA will get the lawyers to consider the matter of precedent, reflect on every likely consequence, and then do everything they can to block it.