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Napalm Death

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manwithnoname

Bravo old man. Bravo.
Banned
Level on points at the top of the league. Seven Wins. Zero defeats. Best defence. This is, so far, an incredibly satisfying start to the season. But how have things changed?

Many of us have commented that the frenetic, high-intensity style associated with Klopp has changed this season, and Klopp's admitted that this is by design:

"With the number of games we have, it's not about chasing a game always like crazy, you have to be smart. We try to be that without killing our nature."

It's nice that Klopp has finally caught up with what some of the more tactically astute observers have been saying for a while now. Indeed, two years ago, I said this in a brilliant thread "The Eye Of The Storm":

"The sturm und drang of Liverpool yesterday was intoxicating, it isn't sustainable. We need to find a way, to be brave enough, to do ......nothing. To have periods of the game in which we agree that nothing will happen. The ability to change the pace and tempo is also about in-game management."

Klopp also addressed the horrible defensive failings that everyone knew would be the undoing of any title bid, despite the free-scoring nature of the team. You can't win the title without a good defence and the ability to win narrowly and protect leads. It's ridiculous that we had to score three or four to win.

But after first getting in a reliable goalscorer who could get the 20 goals a season you need to win a title, then fixing the issue with the defence by signing Van Dijk and the quality keeper everyone craved, and THEN addressing the ability of the team to to be able to play at different tempos, close games out, slow things down, it does seem as if fixing one bit breaks another.

We look disjointed, almost clumsily slow in possession. Wasteful and tentative. The reduction in the high energy, high up pressing seems to have exposed flaws in the team and individuals.

Put simply, gengenpressing is about forcing mistakes high up the pitch and capitalising in a footballing blitzkrieg. It is a method that allows less technically skilled and clever players to overcome superior teams. It's classic underdog CRASH BANG WALLOP football. And it worked against the best sides. But as discussed, it isn't sustainable for a whole season. And is countered by clever coaches or teams that don't want to play.

So yeah, I know why Klopp has changed things up. I said we had to years ago. But the problem is that he doesn't have the players to do it. When the game is slowed, you need bravery and confidence. Errors are exposed. You make less chances and have less opportunity to break at speed. And some of our players don't like that extra time. They become sloppy and nervous. Robbo, TAA, Milner and Henderson struggle when given time.

And the attack are blunted. Mane panics when he is given options. Firmino's flicks don't work when there isn't players flying past him at 100 mph. Salah is crowded out as the defenders have time to regroup.

Perhaps we aren't good enough to play any other way. Klopp knows that, and wanted a reshaped midfield with a new DM, CM and AM to help transition styles - or allow us to use more than one. But he didn't get that AM. Keita has been disappointing. Fabinho isn't trusted.

So it's the same team. And sooner or later, these results are going to start collapsing. When we play City or Chlesea we NEED to go at them. Playing City at their own game isn't going to get us three points - they're better at it.

We're asking Napalm Death to play The Goldberg Variations. Until we get more composers into the side, let's play a bit more death metal.
 
That's article for your Rag you look after at HQ

It's a bit too good a piece tbf for it..

Nice article
 
What is Satisfying this season, is our game management, how we seem to able to close games out..

Napoli aside, it's been excellent from us so far.. A vast improvement on this time last Season..
 
That Game management talk is bollocks.

We simply have a far superior back 5 to 12 months ago.we aren't shutting games down, fucking huddersfield never looked dead on saturday . We arent managing games any better, we just have better players who are able to deal with pressure better, we no longer look prone to collapsing under pressure

I think Mane, Firmino and Salah will all improve and by virtue of that, goals will come and we will start to see the 3s,4s and fives , aslong as gomez, vvd and alisson keep their shit together in the meantime, we'll be ok.
 
That Game management talk is bollocks.

We simply have a far superior back 5 to 12 months ago.we aren't shutting games down, fucking huddersfield never looked dead on saturday . We arent managing games any better, we just have better players who are able to deal with pressure better, we no longer look prone to collapsing under pressure

I think Mane, Firmino and Salah will all improve and by virtue of that, goals will come and we will start to see the 3s,4s and fives , aslong as gomez, vvd and alisson keep their shit together in the meantime, we'll be ok.

It may not be working as intended, but it's obviously what he's trying to do.
 
Even our quick incisive stuff are shit right now, with complete and utter shit final balls in the last game reminiscent of Sunday league teams.
We had tons of chances to create goals, but were let down not by too much thinking but by horrible touches of the ball.
Once this gets sorted, and hopefully will, we’ll be laughing. We also defend the same way we did last season. After the initial counter pressing (which we do less of, yes) we get into the exact same shape as we used to. It’s just that we defend crosses and through balls way better now than in the past due to the players being better.
 
Major worry is the fact that we've scored the same amount of goals in the league as Bournemouth. There's only so long you can have your defence bail you out. Our attackers need to sharpen up, and fast.
 
Major worry is the fact that we've scored the same amount of goals in the league as Bournemouth. There's only so long you can have your defence bail you out. Our attackers need to sharpen up, and fast.

This is like a negative plate to every post about Klopp's Liverpool until this season though innit. I think the top three just need to find form.
 
Even our quick incisive stuff are shit right now, with complete and utter shit final balls in the last game reminiscent of Sunday league teams.
We had tons of chances to create goals, but were let down not by too much thinking but by horrible touches of the ball.
Once this gets sorted, and hopefully will, we’ll be laughing. We also defend the same way we did last season. After the initial counter pressing (which we do less of, yes) we get into the exact same shape as we used to. It’s just that we defend crosses and through balls way better now than in the past due to the players being better.

I do think that the less frantic and high-up pressing used to leave a lot more space for the other team to move into aswell.

But yeah, having Virgil's head in the box has meant we actually clear our lines properly and don't concede a goal from every set-piece.

(not having a spaz in goal helps too, obvs)
 
Whilst I agree with 99% of the original post, I don't think it's inevitable that we can't find a balance.

We've done the whole 'we can score more than you' thing, & now we're doing the 'we can concede less than you' thing, but there is a balance.

Yes, it's definitely stunting our attack, as I alluded to yesterday, not having an attacking midfielder running at their back line makes it easier for defences to stifle us.

All that said, salah alone could have scored two or three every time he's been on the pitch if he's in form.

If you add a Salah in top form to our performances then the parallels to Utd under Ferguson, grinding teams down, looking solid in defence, & having the quality upfront to punish a side, are quite obvious imo.

Whether that's enough to beat a city side who have had a very easy start, enabling them to build up confidence & find their shooting boots whilst ours have had harder opponents & are adjusting to this new more energy efficient side, only time will tell.

I'd also like to believe that Klopp is working with the side in order to try to master in game transitions. Let's face it, being able to play as we do currently, then switch it on for ten minutes & blitz teams, would be almost unbeatable.

There's hints that he's trying it, as evidenced by a few games this season where we've pressed & harried for the first ten minutes, then sat back til 35 mins, gone again til half time, however it's not been seen since Napoli, somethings changed there, & it's not allowed us to attack like we did at our best even when that pattern has been followed.

I have a sneaking suspicion that if we go a couple of goals up again this season he won't be as quick to make a change to kill the game off & will instead let the leash off & let them try to get their rhythm back in the process, all depending on who the opposition is & how dangerous they are obviously.
 
I do think that the less frantic and high-up pressing used to leave a lot more space for the other team to move into aswell.

But yeah, having Virgil's head in the box has meant we actually clear our lines properly and don't concede a goal from every set-piece.

(not having a spaz in goal helps too, obvs)
That bit in brackets is HUGE.
Anyway.. wonder if we’ll be in for an AM in Jan. We really could do with a Coutinho type creator.
If our forwards keep misfiring it won’t make any difference I guess, but can’t hurt to have someone capable of creating behind the front three. I like Shaq but don’t think he’s the first choice AM long term.
 
I reckon Shaq deserves the chance to try to be the coutinho replacement ox was becoming. We still played with the forward three at the time, so naturally if you drop one of Milner, Henderson or Gini for him we'll be a bit more exposed at the back, but we'd definitely score more
 
I reckon Shaq deserves the chance to try to be the coutinho replacement ox was becoming. We still played with the forward three at the time, so naturally if you drop one of Milner, Henderson or Gini for him we'll be a bit more exposed at the back, but we'd definitely score more
He just doesn’t seem consistent enough but hopefully you’re right.
 
I still cant come to terms with people moaning about how we play at the moment.
3 goals conceded after 9 games is the best defensive start to a season ever in our PL history. 6 clean sheets for Alisson is only bettered by Cech for Chelsea i the history of the league. We’re joint top with City. Last season we were 10-12 points behind them at this stage.
The number of points after 9 games is also our best start ever. Just enjoy it.

«Yeah, but we didnt win 86-0 against Huddersfield away».
Well, our record against those teams away after an international game is/was horrendous. 6 defeats in 9 games. So a 1-0 win with a bit of a makeshift side is good enough.

The front 3 will click soon and we’ll score more goals, but for the time being just winning is good enough.
 
I reckon Shaq deserves the chance to try to be the coutinho replacement ox was becoming. We still played with the forward three at the time, so naturally if you drop one of Milner, Henderson or Gini for him we'll be a bit more exposed at the back, but we'd definitely score more
We just need Fabinho to be the DM that got everyone so excited in the summer, then we can play Shaq without losing that solidity at the back.
 
We have been so wasteful up front so far this season that I don't think the style of play is necessarily hindering the attack, they're making poor decisions and missing sitters. If we had been as clinical as we were for large parts of last season we would be winning games by 3 or 4 goals weekly.

I'm still delighted though! What a start to the season.
 
We have been so wasteful up front so far this season that I don't think the style of play is necessarily hindering the attack, they're making poor decisions and missing sitters. If we had been as clinical as we were for large parts of last season we would be winning games by 3 or 4 goals weekly.

I'm still delighted though! What a start to the season.
We were nowhere near that clinical at the same stage last season anyway. Our form in the final two thirds of the season has biased many peoples expectations.
 
It is difficult to reason the "poor" performance in last third to specific factors. But we, as mentioned several times, are still ahead of last season at same time.

The end to season last year was extreme for the club. It has been a while since we ruled CL and this time we did big time. It might well be that the guys didn't have enough time to seset themeselves before they ended up in training camps with different world cup teams, and a lot of them had real high expectations on their shoulders. Especially our front three had pressure on themeselves to deliver. Mane and Salah were carrying the expectation of a whole nation on their shoulders. They both probably need a good rest now, but there is no chance for that to happen, so we have to be patience with them. The quality is still there, so I have no big worries. Maybe also the free flow of goals in pre season make people think it is easier than it is. We need to be sharper in crucial situations.

I think also the more solid midfield, With Milner and Wijnaldum (both non world cup players) have performed better than expected for the start of the season. They run a lot, close down situations and is a real test for any opposition to brake down. But the last few games it looks like they are feeling the miles a bit more. Hopefully Fabinho is more ready to step up and claim his place now. If we also can mould Keita in there I thinkj we have two huge contributers in the way we like to play. Many miles in them as well as better than Hendo-Milner-Wijnaldum to win the ball higher and turn the defnisve sit to an attacking one even quicker than today.
 
Everyone has been saying for weeks and I still believe it, someone is due a pasting.

Didn’t our attack properly click into gear after we scored around a thousand goals against the awful defenses of Maribor and Spartak last season? Hopefully Crvena Zvezda can do the same trick for our attackers’ confidence.
 
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It would be more worrying if didn't get ourselves in some promising positions in the final third. We at least look like creating chances; maybe the front 3 have let the hype get to their heads and their new contracts
 
After 9 league games last season we had 14-16 in goal difference, and this season its 16-3.

Exactly. Attacking wise we're marginally better than we were at this stage last season, in spite of players recovering after the world cup & playing some harder CL teams along the way, & defensively we're much improved.

We're all looking at this in the context to how we ended the season & not how we started it, when you compare the start then it looks much better.

All that isn't to say that everything's rosy, we clearly need to strike a balance between being more solid defensively & going forwards, but it's nowhere near the disaster waiting to happen that a lot of people seem to think it is.
 
Usually you remove the Man City five goal drubbing from your stats, as it was some kind of weird anomaly and therefore didn't count.

But that is all true. It was some kind of weird anomaly and in the end it didn't count. They won the League, which they would have done anyway, and we finished 4 which we had done anyway as Chelsea were 5 Points behind.

And it is weird as they never beat us under Guardiola anyway. We have played 7 games now and we won 4 of them and they have managed to draws besides that weird game. In the TV series they make now Guardiola uses half time in other games to discuss how good we are, and when we met earlier this season he changed his normal gameplan as he was shit scared of us.

So it makes Perfect sense to look at that game as some kind of weird anomaly that didn't count.
 
Usually you remove the Man City five goal drubbing from your stats, as it was some kind of weird anomaly and therefore didn't count.

No, its been said that both the Spurs and City games counted for a big part of the goals conceded, which is true.

But sure, just for you 14-11.
 
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