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Martin Johnson quits England job

Jumped before he was pushed, I dare say.

On TalkSh!te today someone was speculating that Andrew's hanging on waiting for the new CEO to dismiss him so he can get a big payout. Wouldn't surprise me at all, but I suspect that's his Plan B. Plan A is for him to go on squatting there like some poisoned toad, raking in 200 grand a year for bugger all.
 
They were going to sack Alred as well today, but rumour has it he was on the golf course.

I can't see Andrew holding onto his job. He's hand picked 3 failed england managers + and now all of this on top.
 
That stuff about Alred is a real disappointment. He's been such a good kicking coach in his time.

As for Andrew, nothing would surprise me any more. The useless fecker has led a charmed life in rugby all the way along.
 
It was fairly obvious that things wre not right in the England camp as the WC unfolded. We nopw have a clearer understanding of why.

The sooner Rob Andrew goes the better. He's responsible for the appointment of the last 3 coaches all of whom failed to a greater or lesser extent.
 
The latest is that Andrew is accepting some of the criticisms made of him, e.g.not supporting Johnno enough during his time running the team, but STILL won't resign. I remember people like him when I was still at work, skilled climbers of the greasy pole who managed somehow to slide out of view when anything got difficult. Andrew absolutely must not be allowed to get away with it any more.
 
Who would be the person to make the call and sack him mate?

Johnno has come out and given a interview in which he sticks up for his coaches and the England players. He might not of been the best man for the job, yet he comes across as a top bloke.
 
The person to sack him needs to be the new CEO when appointed. What worries me about that is the extent of the influence Andrew will have over the appointment to begin with. In my worst nightmares he himself gets the job. [Shudder]

The difference between him and Johnno is twofold. One - Johnno didn't win way too many England caps as a player, and two - Johnno knows the meaning of honour and integrity.
 
Johnson is a stand up guy, good interview alright:

Johnson said: "If you take certain comments that have been written immediately after the event and only report the negative things it is clearly not a true reflection of the mood of the squad. They are opinions and certainly not truths, written in emotive times for anyone. A lot of them we were aware of as a management group.

"I find it, the way it's been reported, the imbalance of that reporting, is to me one of the worst things. In that report there is obviously praise for some people. I don't think it's fair on the players – one thing that team did was stick together.

"You sometimes let things go by but the way this has been reported has been so inaccurate that I had to come here. A lot of the players are horrified as to how this has come out and how it's been portrayed.

"To pick out the most emotive and the worst comments is dangerous and very damaging."

On the subject of his team of coaches, who were the subject of a number of critical comments from unnamed players, Johnson said: "Coaches aren't there to be liked. It's not a popularity contest. We live and die by what we do. As a coach you pay the price and some of us did that." Brian Smith, the attack coach, resigned on Thursday.

Asked about the incident in which three players were accused of inappropriate behaviour towards a hotel chambermaid – which, according to one of the leaked comments, led to a suggestion that the woman should be paid around £14,000 in "hush money" – Johnson said: "I had spoken to the girl involved before, after, a number of times. The players had involved had apologised, we thought that was the end of it.

"Three weeks later there was a demand through a lawyer for money. We said to the players: 'You need to now get independent legal advice, all of you.'

"I said to them: 'You need to apologise to her.' And that's what they did. You have a number of outside factors involved including the media and a number of influences round her which kept the story going for a number of weeks."

Asked about the suggestion that the players had been advised to pay the woman in question, Johnson said: "She asked for compensation and an option you could do was to do that."

Johnson was asked if he regretted his handling of the affair in which players, including Mike Tindall, were photographed and filmed in a Queenstown bar.

Johnson said: "Mike knew what he had done and where that would lead to. He was in a bad place and had put the team in a bad situation and at that point you have to support the player.

"I spoke with [the players] after the Queenstown incident and left them in no uncertain terms as to where I thought they were at that point and after that there wasn't an issue until the end of the tournament.

"With hindsight we would have changed a lot of things and made life easier for everyone. We made mistakes as a group and could have handled things differently."

Johnson dismissed questions about the position of Rob Andrew, the RFU's elite rugby director, who on Thursday said he would not resign.

Asked about the level of support offered to him by Andrew during the World Cup, he said: "The key thing there is hindsight. We said right at start, if you make one wrong step it goes right to the top of the game. The ramifications are huge and some players were late appreciating that.

"I've no regrets with what I did. You act in the best interests of the team and the individual at the time."

Johnson said "I took the responsibility, that's why I'm not in a job now, I accept that," but he added: "There are good things there as well. We won 10 out of 13 games. We won the Six Nations Championship. Brian has been criticised but we scored the most tries in two of the three years he was there for the Six Nations.

"There are facts that are being papered over. There is a good group of players there with a fantastic attitude that want to be successful who are horrified about how they and the team are being portrayed. There is a good core group who will be ultimately stronger for this when they come out of the other side. It is pretty horrible right now."
 
Barbarians = pointless.

Used to be the best players from across the World. Now a stroll out exercise for players who can be slightly arsed against an International team who play well over 3 times the amount of games teams used to. A weeks prep can't compete with that.
 
So then.........

England will wait until after the six nations to appoint a new manager.

Rob Andew keeps his job, but will not have anything to do with the first team.
 
Be interesting to see who takes temporary charge for the Six Nations then. One paper was speculating they might ask Ashton back to tide England over.

It'll also be interesting to see whether a big name is willing to take the chance of accepting the permanent job while Andrew's still there, whatever arrangements might now be put in place. He was effectively demoted from being in charge of the England team before, but somehow managed to slide back into that role. One thing's for absolutely certain and that is that Woodward won't go near any job with the ERFU as long as Andrew sticks around.
 
I know you have your doubts, but they were very clear in making the point (numerous times) that he'll have nothing to do with first team affairs. His job will be for the most part to develop relations with the premiership clubs (which by all accounts he's done well at) and to look over your younger sides. They are also putting in place another man who will act as a go between for the new manager and new Chief (something that has worked well for both Wales and NZ).

The reason why they stated they are taking their time in appointing a new manager is two fold

1. Gives them enough time to do a proper search

But according to them most importantly:

2. They want to put in place a new overall chief who will see over the England national team (they want him to in effect pick the new manager).

Considering their previous track records at the ERU i'd be very sceptical, but in all honesty they came across very well indeed. Personally i think you might be on the road to recovery.
 
Thanks for that. It sounds fair enough for the most part. I remain of the view that there's a risk involved in keeping Andrew around, given his record of office-politicking (and his obvious skill at it), and would much prefer it if he buggered off. You can safely assume that Woodward takes the same view and will not be available to the ERFU while this situation continues. However, it's true that Andrew's said to have done well in one area in which he'll apparently now be operating again, so fingers crossed.
 
He's unquestionably done well at Northampton and may be ready for the step up, but I can't shake an uneasy feeling that he could turn out to be England Rugby's equivalent of Steve McClaren, appointed because a head of steam built up behind the idea that it needed to be an Englishman and he was the best available, without full regard to the question whether he himself has what the international manager's job takes. My preference would still be for someone with international pedigree and I'd be looking seriously at Jake White - been there, done it, lifted a World Cup.
 
What have England football done under foreign coaches? Won nothing. Have they improved? Do the players respect them more? Or are they gap-filling?

Give an English bloke a chance I say.
 
Chris Ashton is either stupid or has a death wish! I see he picked on another Tuilagi this weekend (the big brother this time), which resulted in 2 red cards.
 
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