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does rafa deserve credit for torres?

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spider-Neil

spider-Neil

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your opinion please?

at AM torres' goal return was decent as a forward. rafa bought this talented but as yet unproven player moved him to the position of out and out striker, the player is now argubly the best striker in world football. so does rafa deserve credit for this?
 
Well, it seems a bit mean to blame him for everything negative whilst declining to praise him for anything positive. But that is what many do.
 
Of course he does, though I'm sure some certain cunt(s) will find a way to put it down to anyone but Rafa.
 
Obv.Rafa should get the credit (along with the player for putting the work in), but in any case Torres himself has credited Rafa with helping him to become the player he is now.
 
Benitez has really improved some players, there is no doubt about that and it's the reason we can attract the likes of Aquilani
 
[quote author=rebel23 link=topic=36422.msg961933#msg961933 date=1255452667]
Benitez has really improved some players, there is no doubt about that and it's the reason we can attract the likes of Aquilani
[/quote]

Aquilani came after seeing Kewell win the Champions League.
 
Of course he does to an extent but there could be other factors such as he's playing with better players around him, being more suited to the English game etc.
 
[quote author=Boozer link=topic=36422.msg961941#msg961941 date=1255453645]

Aquilani came after seeing Kewell win the Champions League.
[/quote]

That must have been Messi.
 
Yes.

He's significantly contributed to turning Torres into the the sexy goal scoring beast that we all know and love.

Next it's time for him to work his magic on Babel.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36422.msg961996#msg961996 date=1255462499]
Yes.

He's significantly contributed to turning Torres into the the sexy goal scoring beast that we all know and love.

Next it's time for him to work his magic on Babel.
[/quote

He's Rafa not fucking Jesus!
 
torres would have been a great player regardless of which top tier team he went to imo

rafa deserves credit for buying him but he didn't do anything with torres that any other top flight manager would have failed to do.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36422.msg962050#msg962050 date=1255469814]
torres would have been a great player regardless of which top tier team he went to imo

rafa deserves credit for buying him but he didn't do anything with torres that any other top flight manager would have failed to do.
[/quote]

You're just being a WUM mate - Rafa took a 15 goal per season striker (and he barely hit 15 la liga goal every year) and put him in a system where hit hit 30 in his first season and would have done so in his 2nd season had he stayed healthy. Give credit where credit is due.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36422.msg962050#msg962050 date=1255469814]
he didn't do anything with torres that any other top flight manager would have failed to do.
[/quote]

You don't even pay attention to your own sentences, do you? :🙂
 
Torres was hardly "unproven" when we signed him. He was playing up front one his own in one of Europe's top leagues and performing well.

Benitez deserves credit for signing him just as he really began to hit his peak.
 
Torres would acknowledge the help he's had from the whole coaching squad. It's just petty for others to pretend he's just evolved naturally.
 
Rafael Benítez has made me a better player, says Fernando Torres

guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 1 July 2009


The Liverpool striker Fernando Torres has credited his manager, Rafael Benítez, for helping him become a better player during his two seasons in England. The Spanish striker arrived at Anfield in the summer of 2007 from Atlético Madrid with a reputation for being a prodigious talent without necessarily being prolific.

The Spain international scored 91 goals in 244 matches for his hometown club before his £20million-plus transfer to Merseyside and Benítez was instantly rewarded for his club-record investment as Torres scored 33 times in his first campaign in English football – adding another 17 in an injury-dogged last season.

His half-century of goals came up in only 84 matches and the 25-year-old believes the influence of Benítez had a major impact on him adapting so quickly to the Barclays Premier League.

"Rafa concentrates on the professional side of things," said Torres, who signed an improved contract in May. "He tries to improve every minor detail and movement you carry out during the course of a game and he also explains the reasons behind his decisions.

"He's obsessed that you understand what you are doing and why. He's not happy that you do things just because he tells you that something has to be done. He says: 'Do it like this. Do you understand why you are being told to do so? No? We'll go through it again then'.

"I remember when I signed for the club people were questioning me as a goalscorer. I received criticism because I wasn't getting goals. The first thing he told me was that I was signed to score goals. Benítez is adamant that I live in the [penalty] area because that's where you get goals. That was the first thing he told me, the wing is for the wingers, and that the striker should be focused on the two rival centre-backs."


Oh well, what does Torres know.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/jul/01/fernando-torres-rafael-benitez-liverpool/print
 
[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36422.msg962062#msg962062 date=1255471419]
Rafael Benítez has made me a better player, says Fernando Torres

guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 1 July 2009


The Liverpool striker Fernando Torres has credited his manager, Rafael Benítez, for helping him become a better player during his two seasons in England. The Spanish striker arrived at Anfield in the summer of 2007 from Atlético Madrid with a reputation for being a prodigious talent without necessarily being prolific.

The Spain international scored 91 goals in 244 matches for his hometown club before his £20million-plus transfer to Merseyside and Benítez was instantly rewarded for his club-record investment as Torres scored 33 times in his first campaign in English football – adding another 17 in an injury-dogged last season.

His half-century of goals came up in only 84 matches and the 25-year-old believes the influence of Benítez had a major impact on him adapting so quickly to the Barclays Premier League.

"Rafa concentrates on the professional side of things," said Torres, who signed an improved contract in May. "He tries to improve every minor detail and movement you carry out during the course of a game and he also explains the reasons behind his decisions.

"He's obsessed that you understand what you are doing and why. He's not happy that you do things just because he tells you that something has to be done. He says: 'Do it like this. Do you understand why you are being told to do so? No? We'll go through it again then'.

"I remember when I signed for the club people were questioning me as a goalscorer. I received criticism because I wasn't getting goals. The first thing he told me was that I was signed to score goals. Benítez is adamant that I live in the [penalty] area because that's where you get goals. That was the first thing he told me, the wing is for the wingers, and that the striker should be focused on the two rival centre-backs."


Oh well, what does Torres know.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/jul/01/fernando-torres-rafael-benitez-liverpool/print
[/quote]

Checkmate.
 
No wonder Stevie and Torres both admire Rafa so much, without him they'd not be the fine players we see today.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36422.msg962067#msg962067 date=1255472008]
No wonder Stevie and Torres both admire Rafa so much, without him they'd not be the fine players we see today.
[/quote]

Nah mate. What would they know mate? Them only being footballers and all. The Rafa bashers clearly know better in this case.
 
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=36422.msg962070#msg962070 date=1255472298]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36422.msg962067#msg962067 date=1255472008]
No wonder Stevie and Torres both admire Rafa so much, without him they'd not be the fine players we see today.
[/quote]

Nah mate. What would they know mate? Them only being footballers and all. The Rafa bashers clearly know better in this case.
[/quote]

Managers only get to work with players for about 300 days a year (a bit of running and a few press ups i guess), i'm not sure if thats enough time to have any real impact on a individuals game is it?
 
don't know what this checkmate bollocks is. rafa as i and others have said did well buying torres.

whilst this is all a matter of opinion rather than fact i think other top flight managers would have got a similar return from torres.

the sign of a great manager isn't just about what you can do with the best of players but what you can do with emerging, failing and indeed average ones.

if rafa manages to do something with voronin, babel and n'gog or bring through the likes of nemeth then that is when we should be applauding him the most.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36422.msg962067#msg962067 date=1255472008]
No wonder Stevie and Torres both admire Rafa so much, without him they'd not be the fine players we see today.
[/quote]

Sure "there's no one in the squad that likes Rafa" - it's gotta be true, I read it on SCM the other day.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36422.msg962073#msg962073 date=1255473205]
don't know what this checkmate bollocks is. rafa as i and others have said did well buying torres.

whilst this is all a matter of opinion rather than fact i think other top flight managers would have got a similar return from torres.

the sign of a great manager isn't just about what you can do with the best of players but what you can do with emerging, failing and indeed average ones.

if rafa manages to do something with voronin, babel and n'gog or bring through the likes of nemeth then that is when we should be applauding him the most.
[/quote]

Are you applauding him for bringing through our young (and now international) Argentinian defender?
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=36422.msg962096#msg962096 date=1255475598]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36422.msg962067#msg962067 date=1255472008]
No wonder Stevie and Torres both admire Rafa so much, without him they'd not be the fine players we see today.
[/quote]

Sure "there's no one in the squad that likes Rafa" - it's gotta be true, I read it on SCM the other day.
[/quote]

Ha.

Rosco tends to use that one as a last resort when we've not lost in a couple of games.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36422.msg962073#msg962073 date=1255473205]
don't know what this checkmate bollocks is. rafa as i and others have said did well buying torres.

whilst this is all a matter of opinion rather than fact i think other top flight managers would have got a similar return from torres.

the sign of a great manager isn't just about what you can do with the best of players but what you can do with emerging, failing and indeed average ones.

if rafa manages to do something with voronin, babel and n'gog or bring through the likes of nemeth then that is when we should be applauding him the most.
[/quote]

how about you suggest a manger who can acclaim all credits for the superstar he bring up?

Arsene has Eboue, pennant, jeffers etc...
fag-uson has djemba-djemba, and many other overprice youngster, who thrives on 'i am from Manures academy', see richardson.

If there is a manager who can boast of making the best out of every SINGLE player, then lets hail Jesus is back again.
 
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=36422.msg962059#msg962059 date=1255471025]
Torres was hardly "unproven" when we signed him. He was playing up front one his own in one of Europe's top leagues and performing well.

Benitez deserves credit for signing him just as he really began to hit his peak.
[/quote]

That's nearly as bad as Rage's view.

He was always a potentially class player, he looked more in the Rooney mould when I'd seen him playing for Atletico and Spain. But you can't assume he would have 'hit his peak and done the same anyway'. He came over here and doubled his scoring tally while having his position refined too and adjusting to a different setup and league.

Failing to recognise Benitez' part in his fantastic form during his first season is just a blatant dumbing down of Rafa's contribution, just because you don't like him.

Like I said, no different to Rage, just put into a coherent sentence instead.
 
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