New contract appaz. No surprise. Happy with that. I'd be happy if it was a lifetime deal and came with a statue.
Origi
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Forever obviously.
Why aren't we more excited about Origi?
Why is Divock?
Legend.
Why is Divock?
Legend.
I think the muted response is due to him not being a "new player". I think many of us are saving our excitement for the "big summer signing".
I still celebrate that like it just happened. Fucking awesome. Delighted for the lad, and with the 3 in front, do we really need to waste money on someone else??? Other areas need addressing.
Oh no, I was just using the occasion to refer to an old thread where someone posed the question why arent we excited about him. This was many moons ago and really apropos about nothing at this point.
Well, I think this means we have decided that Origi can do some heavy lifting in the squad, for better or for worse. Before the Everton injury, he was really doing everything you'd want from a number 9. Despite the amazing cameos last season, I don't think we know that he's ever going to be the player we want him to be. I'll be honest, I would rather we sold him off his moment in the limelight and brought in some shit hot no. 9. I'm clearly lacking a soul.
Ditto.
Big fan before the injury and failed loans but now I just struggle to believe he can deliver consistently.
Fact is that Klopp only really used Origi out of necessity last season. Same goes for a couple of our other squaddies.
We need to bring in some genuine competition.
Guys, I'm sorry, but I really think with a front 3 as good as Salah-Mane-Firmino you can't have "genuine competition." There is no way a player of similar calibre will consider coming here to "compete" with 3 other established world-class players who have already formed a tightly-calibrated attacking unit. Even the richest teams don't have that. PSG has no "competition" for Neymar-Mbappe-Cavani, instead they have a couple of players (Draxler, Di Maria) who can complement them by playing in midfield and also step into the front 3 when necessary. Barca had no competition for Mezzi-Suarez-Neymar – even a player as talented as Alexis was rotting on the bench and had to leave. In the best Barca teams of recent years, they would typically have Iniesta step in from midfield when they needed to sub for one of the attackers – it might seem disruptive to ask a player to change positions, but actually it helped them keep the cohesion (and remember that world-class players have ability to perform well in multiple positions – the whole "playing players out of position" thing really only applies to more limited or younger ones. You see this now with Mane and Salah – as they've matured, Klopp got more options to move them around the pitch). Oh, and Man City actually don't have a world-class front 3 – that's why there is more rotation there, but their main strength is in midfield.
A world-class front 3 in their prime play all the time and when one of them is injured or needs a break, you just deal with it – tweak the formation or fill in with other players and just accept the inevitable drop in quality. Hopefully your team still has enough quality elsewhere to win most games even when not at absolute full strength. But the whole concept of 4 world-class forwards competing for 3 positions is a myth, it has never been done in football as far as I can remember and Liverpool surely won't be the first team to do it. We're not going to buy Mbappe to "alternate" with Mane and Salah – the only way such a transfer could work is as a replacement for one of them. If you believe otherwise, you're just setting yourself up for disappointment.
A world-class front 3 in their prime play all the time and when one of them is injured or needs a break, you just deal with it – tweak the formation or fill in with other players and just accept the inevitable drop in quality. Hopefully your team still has enough quality elsewhere to win most games even when not at absolute full strength. But the whole concept of 4 world-class forwards competing for 3 positions is a myth, it has never been done in football as far as I can remember and Liverpool surely won't be the first team to do it. We're not going to buy Mbappe to "alternate" with Mane and Salah – the only way such a transfer could work is as a replacement for one of them. If you believe otherwise, you're just setting yourself up for disappointment.
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Klopp has made it clear that Brewster will fill that role.
And to add one more thing – yes, it's possible to have a quality back-up for your world-class front 3. We actually do: Shaqiri is one (why is nobody mentioning him when discussing our striking options?) and Origi is another. But it has to be someone willing to be a back-up, someone who knows and accepts the role he's signed up for. So not only are we not going to buy a star forward like Mbappe (unless one of Salah or Mane is leaving); I also find it hard to believe that we're going to spend £60-80M to bring in another high-profile and talented player who is still a little below the level of our current front 3, like Nikolas Pepe. If he's not going to break into our first-choice 11 at the expense of Sadio, Bobby or Mo, it doesn't matter if he's 10% worse or 50% worse than them – he'll still effectively be a back-up and if he's ambitious an unhappy one at that (like Alexis Sanchez was at Barca).
This is not to say that we can't buy big attacking talents anymore – we can try to nurture really young ones, like Brewster, we can sign superb players who are in the twilight of their career to perform a specific role. But most likely any truly big attacking talent we sign next will have to be a midfielder who is also capable of playing in the front 3, someone like Ox or Lallana.
This is not to say that we can't buy big attacking talents anymore – we can try to nurture really young ones, like Brewster, we can sign superb players who are in the twilight of their career to perform a specific role. But most likely any truly big attacking talent we sign next will have to be a midfielder who is also capable of playing in the front 3, someone like Ox or Lallana.
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Decent outcome. Means we don’t lose him for nothing.
His big game goals have been great but his overall game hasn’t improved at all.
His big game goals have been great but his overall game hasn’t improved at all.
Lets say him and Studge were on a combined 230k a week last season and the coming season Divock can put together the same contribution on his own for 100k a week then we are in a good place.
That's true, with certain forward lines there is only so much you can rotate.
But genuine competition doesn't have to mean a like for like replacement - for example, you mentioned a world class player (like Iniesta) filling in with tweaks to the system.
We don't have those options though.
Perhaps I'm being overly negative about certain players and the likes of Shaqiri, Ox, Keita and Origi will really step up this season (as they did on a couple occasions towards the end of last season - hello Barca).
Perhaps I'm underestimating the abilities of certain youngsters who may come in and have a TAA like impact.
It just feels like we're in a rare position of strength at the moment and we're not capitalising on it. The squad, in certain areas looks thin, and our best players have all been playing throughout the summer. Risky stuff.
As for "Even the richest teams don't have that"... that's not strictly true. They're just more willing / able to let players rot on the bench as an insurance policy.
I'm not disagreeing with that, mate. I'm all for signing a great attacking midfielder; if it's up to me I'm selling Lallana and signing De Beek, Aouar or Havertz – someone who can play in behind the current front 3 or seamlessly move forward to replace one of them. My post was just explaining why I think we won't sign another expensive wing-forward this summer.
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You're going to look pretty silly when Mbappe and Pepe roll in Rurik.
Definitely.
I agree with this. We are not competing against just anybody, we are competing with Citeh for the biggest prize, the same Citeh who had strengthened and have Jesus sitting on the bench for them. They have just bought a 60m replacement for Fernandinho, and will no doubt add another defender and a left back in the 50m bracket.
I think we need another forward, someone better than Origi. And let's face it there are plenty of players who are better than Origi. If we had, say a Werner last season we would have won the league. Even if Werner had only played 10 games and end up being unhappy, we would have won the league and nothing else matters.
It is honourable we are doing things the "right way", being sentimental and loyal with players and all that stuff, but an injury, or a extended run of bad form to any of the front 3, and we will be cursing ourselves when we play second feedle to Citeh yet again.
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