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set pieces

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mark1975

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We haven't got a problem have we, its the players not the shit system...

Both incidents leading to the goal saw us caught under the ball, again.
 
[quote author=Hooz link=topic=35536.msg934554#msg934554 date=1251556758]
Fuck off
[/quote]

Whatever cockend.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35536.msg934548#msg934548 date=1251556657]
We haven't got a problem have we, its the players not the shit system...

Both incidents leading to the goal saw us caught under the ball, again.
[/quote]

It wasn't a shit system when we used it before. I'm sure the zonal system doesn't necessitate Insua forgetting how to jump and attack a ball.
 
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=35536.msg934565#msg934565 date=1251556879]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35536.msg934548#msg934548 date=1251556657]
We haven't got a problem have we, its the players not the shit system...

Both incidents leading to the goal saw us caught under the ball, again.
[/quote]

It wasn't a shit system when we used it before. I'm sure the zonal system doesn't necessitate Insua forgetting how to jump and attack a ball.
[/quote]

4 games, 6 goals, all from setpieces.

Of course the system works, but it takes months to get a grip with. That costs us over the course of a season. Whatever you want to level at the players, they've struggled with it at the start of every season.
 
And talking about our own set pieces.

STEVEN GERRARD. STOP TAKING CORNERS AND FREE KICKS. YOU ARE SHIT AT THEM.
ABOUT 1 IN 10 ARE GOOD.
 
I just don't think we're that great in the air as a team in general, Mark.

We always blame the delivery as we hardly score many from set pieces but not having enough good players in the air could be the real reason.

How many in our team would you say are good in the air? Agger, Carra, Stevie and Nando? Johnson is tall but I haven't seen enough to make a judgement either way.
 
Tinto - we've had sami in there and conceded from setpieces, welve got this new lad in today who is clearly good in the air.

I'm not even gonna mention zonal marking anymore, we just have some kind of issue defending setpieces, its been a much talked about issue for years under rafa, I really don't know how people don't see it. Defending well for 3/4 of the season doesn't excuse the fact it takes so long foor the fucking thing to work, and even then is still occasionally exploited.
 
We had a problem for an age now so the fault lies with the Manager and his coaching staff. As Tinto said, were also not blessed with a team that is generally brilliant in the air.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35536.msg934614#msg934614 date=1251558199]
Tinto - we've had sami in there and conceded from setpieces, welve got this new lad in today who is clearly good in the air.

I'm not even gonna mention zonal marking anymore, we just have some kind of issue defending setpieces, its been a much talked about issue for years under rafa, I really don't know how people don't see it. Defending well for 3/4 of the season doesn't excuse the fact it takes so long foor the fucking thing to work, and even then is still occasionally exploited.
[/quote]

Of course there's no evidence but who knows, we might be even conceding more goals if we used another system.

Loads of goals are conceded every season by teams that don't man-to-man mark properly but that system is never under the same scrutiny that zonal marking is. Zonal marking's only much talked about because it's different to what we're used to.
 
But the system has worked well before, so I find it hard to believe that the system is at fault. Players simply arent doing what they should.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35536.msg934595#msg934595 date=1251557414]

[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=35536.msg934565#msg934565 date=1251556879]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35536.msg934548#msg934548 date=1251556657]
We haven't got a problem have we, its the players not the shit system...

Both incidents leading to the goal saw us caught under the ball, again.
[/quote]

It wasn't a shit system when we used it before. I'm sure the zonal system doesn't necessitate Insua forgetting how to jump and attack a ball.
[/quote]

4 games, 6 goals, all from setpieces.

Of course the system works, but it takes months to get a grip with. That costs us over the course of a season. Whatever you want to level at the players, they've struggled with it at the start of every season.
[/quote]

I agree with you, something really has to be done regarding the set pieces.

But come on, 6 goals? The OG against Villa and the second goal today wasn't exactly the system's fault.

And I can't believe what the fuck we were doing before the first goal. Three players standing in their zones watching the second ball go to an unattacked Davies. Unbelievable..
 
The big question is:

Is it really set pieces or is it Carragher?

Sure Carra is a legend and all but some of the goals we've conceded is because of him.
 
I think Marks exactly right to draw criticism to the system at present, so I guess I'm just another Sky pundit too.

Including Insua we've had three new additions to our defence in recent times, and if players don't know what they're doing we should be using a system they do understand. It's proving too costly.

And yes, set pieces can be practised realistically within training.
 
Insua, Mascher, Yossi and Lucas aren't tall and none of them are particularly great in the air. Throw in Skrtel as I don't think he's that good in the air as well and you can see why we do sometime struggle against tall teams.

The advantage of zonal marking is that our good players in the air aren't pulled away from the danger areas by decoy runs and can just concentrate on heading the ball away. Well, that's the theory anyway...
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=35536.msg934812#msg934812 date=1251563414]
I think Marks exactly right to draw criticism to the system at present, so I guess I'm just another Sky pundit too.

Including Insua we've had three new additions to our defence in recent times, and if players don't know what they're doing, we should be using a system they do understand. It's proving too costly.

And yes, set pieces can be practised realistically within training.
[/quote]

Considering we are so shit at attacking set pieces, I dont think our defenders are getting any practice in training.
 
every team we ever play will see this as a weakness and target us for the foreseeable future.

i would love to see a settled back 4 of aurelio agger carra and johnson as soon as possible as i think we'll get better at it although i do think other teams have sussed how to beat our zonal marking more than ever before.
 
We look all at sea whenever a ball is pumped into the box and so far it's cost us dear. The number of goals we've conceded from set-pieces this season is fucking appalling and needs addressing immediately. Every time the opposition get a corner or a free-kick near the box now, we look like conceding.
 
were we zonal marking in rafa's 1st season when we won the champions league? maybe i'm getting senile but i remember seeing a much more well organised defence back then that didn't look like it would concede from corners and free kicks the way we do now.
 
We were zonal from day one. Fact is we've lost a lot of players who were good in the air and replaced them with players who aren't so good. Hyypia, Riise, Momo etc. All are much much better in the air than Skrtel, Insua/Auelio, Lucas/Mascherano.
 
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