Nuri Sahin

[Brizzle]

I think BR has his orders of preference for each of the 3 midfield roles and now that Lucas is back, the switching of Allen to CM has pushed Sahin further down that list:

AM (1. Gerrard, 2. Shelvey)
CM (1. Allen, 2. Shelvey, 3. Sahin, 4. Henderson)
DM (1. Lucas, 2. Allen, 3. Henderson, 4. Sahin)

I actually rate Sahin, he is classy on the ball and takes up good positions in the box which is pretty important when playing a single striker up front who likes to roam. With Allen and Lucas both on the pitch though, he isn't likely to get a start and his only chance of a sub would be to replace Allen and not to replace Lucas from what I can tell. Plus Jonjo seems to be ahead of him for this too.

Not ideal to bring in a loan signing with bags of potential when we don't get the chance to play him.

 

[dmishra]

I don't really know what the ins and outs are but he is one of the most talented players we have at the club right now and it'd be a shame if he came and went without us really knowing he was here.

Exactly this. I'd be pretty gutted.

We rarely bring in talented players in the first place. And when we do, we rarely get anything out of them. 😡

 

[DHSC]

What's his best position?

 

[Glen C]

Exactly this. I'd be pretty gutted.

We rarely bring in talented players in the first place. And when we do, we rarely get anything out of them. 😡

He may be talented but doesn't seem to want to work hard. You can't get away with that as a midfielder in the premiership. Seems to want to rely on talent alone which isn't enough.

 

[dmishra]

He may be talented but doesn't seem to want to work hard. You can't get away with that as a midfielder in the premiership. Seems to want to rely on talent alone which isn't enough.

That's a lazy conclusion based on hopelessly limited data. Anyway, good luck to him if he's leaving. If not, we need to give him a fair shot before discarding him.

 

[Glen C]

That's a conclusion based on hopelessly limited data. Anyway, good luck to him if he's leaving. If not, we need to give him a fair shot before discarding him.

Even when he wasn't injured he was just sitting as an unused sub. So for whatever reason he's obviously not impressing Rodgers. Like Rodgers said it's not just about performing on the pitch but everyday in training. So how is he not getting a fair shot?

 

[mark1975]

Even when he wasn't injured he was just sitting as an unused sub. So for whatever reason he's obviously not impressing Rodgers. Like Rodgers said it's not just about performing on the pitch but everyday in training. So how is he not getting a fair shot?

There are alot of players who've had a fair shot with us though and are still getting one and failing to impress on a regular basis, so applying that rule to a new player who's had a fairly lengthy injury AND is acclimatising to a new league sounds a bit speculative and largely unfair. He's talented and maybe just needs a bit of indulgence. Lucas and Allen have brought nothing to the table this season but are still and will continue to get a fair amount of perseverance.

 

[Glen C]

There are alot of players who've had a fair shot with us though and are still getting one and failing to impress on a regular basis, so applying that rule to a new player who's had a fairly lengthy injury AND is acclimatising to a new league sounds a bit speculative and largely unfair. He's talented and maybe just needs a bit of indulgence. Lucas and Allen have brought nothing to the table this season but are still and will continue to get a fair amount of perseverance.

I understand that and couldn't disagree with that at all. All im saying is that they are obviously showing more in training than he is hence why he's not getting picked. Maybe he's just not showing enough desire. Rodgers is always going on about mentality and effort as well as talent.

Also maybe i am being harsh but when you have a loan signing who's only going to be here for one season you really need him to be able to hit the ground running. Its no good him starting to come good in february or march when our season is practically over. When i did a contract in Sweden, i wasn't told you can have a few months to settle in. It was a case of getting used to your environment quickly and settling fast otherwise getting the sack and being sent back to the UK. I know its different scenarios but you get my point. He's not a red, he's a madrid player being hired by us to help out in midfied and right now he's not doing a very good job.

 

[mark1975]

As I said in the other Sahin thread, I understand the weighing up of the deal and why it could be deemed as failing to be value for money - he's been injured and his impact has been marginal, so I get that. I just don't get the logic in the idea that he's failed already, while other players who are already ground into the Premiership have been underwhelming yet are still getting a regular starting berth. Hardwork is always a great ideal, but sometimes you have to sacrifice that for a bit of verve and character.

 

[gene hughes]

That Sahin/Allen partnership has been great, rock solid. It's lucky for Rodgers that Assaidi and Borini have also been such a lethal attacking force or people would be asking questions about his judgment.

 

[Glen C]

As I said in the other Şahin thread, I understand the weighing up of the deal and why it could be deemed as failing to be value for money - he's been injured and his impact has been marginal, so I get that. I just don't get the logic in the idea that he's failed already, while other players who are already ground into the Premiership have been underwhelming yet are still getting a regular starting berth. Hardwork is always a great ideal, but sometimes you have to sacrifice that for a bit of verve and character.

Yeah i understand that as the majority of our midfield has been a failure. And yeah that verve and character would be good but can you say sahin has provided that? Has he provided that cutting edge to our midfield? I don't think he has. Regardless of fitness, i was expecting a bit more presence about him when on the pitch. But most times he's been pretty anonymous.

 

[gene hughes]

Most people would prefer to see one of Dalglish's "flops" start ahead of Sahin, including, it would seem, our current manager.

 

[hmmmmm1]

Some players are just not suited to the premier league, thankfully we have only lost out on wages.

Ship him out.

 

[Fabio]

Most people would prefer to see one of Dalglish's "flops" start ahead of Şahin, including, it would seem, our current manager.

This upsets me

 

[Glen C]

He's on the bench today. Let's see if he's used.

 

[RolandG]

Sahin will be off. He hasn't impressed Rodgers enough.

 

[Glen C]

Yep, unused sub. If he rated him at all he could have brought him on yesterday. Time to get rid if we can. He's just not suited to the premiership.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

This is a player we really really will regret not giving more of a chance to ... He's a phenomenal talent, but I guess it's not meant to be.

 

[Fabio]

Sad times. It's as bizarre as mascherano rotting on West hams bench

 

[Glen C]

This is a player we really really will regret not giving more of a chance to ... He's a phenomenal talent, but I guess it's not meant to be.

I dunno, he may have talent but lacks heart and desire. He's been here a few months now and not shown much. Yeah technically good and likes to get in the box. But what about the other stuff like tracking back, tackling and generally working hard for the team?

 

[Glen C]

Sad times. It's as bizarre as mascherano rotting on West hams bench

I don't see how it's bizarre at all. Lucas is our holding midfielder. Henderson has worked hard and earned his place in the team and Gerrard is playing out of his skin. So you tell me who we're meant to drop to put in sahin who isn't playing as good as them.

 

[jimmy]

Rodgers has been benching his darling MF general recently playing other MFers ahead of him. Looks to me like he's actually picking up the ones who's current form is best. I believe he really wanted it to work for Sahin. Pity that it hasn't (so far) and again, I hope we're not making a big mistake here.

 

[mark1975]

I dunno, he may have talent but lacks heart and desire. He's been here a few months now and not shown much. Yeah technically good and likes to get in the box. But what about the other stuff like tracking back, tackling and generally working hard for the team?

What are you basing this on Glen? I get that he's not figured much, but from that we can surmise alot of things. Rodgers might not rate him now that he's seen him, Sahin might not like it here, he might not fit the system, he might not work hard enough, he might have been out injured too much to be deemed cost effective. Writing him off based on a handful of games and time spent out injured is lazy, as said, you're saying he lacks "heart and desire" and that he's "been here a few months and not showed much". He's scored and created about as many as most of our other players bar Suarez, in half the time. Now there might be a grain of truth to the fact that he's struggled with the physical aspect (he wasn't alone in getting brushed aside in midfield), but it takes time to settle sometimes and he's had a fairly bad injury to deal with. You're acting like he's been given more than enough playing time and that he's been available enough to make such an assessment - he hasn't, so I don't know why you're talking like we've seen enough of the lad.

It's also worth noting he hasn't played much football over the last year, so why he's getting written off so early in his career with us is beyond me, yet people still moan about Pacheco not getting a chance and that managers haven't given him a fair crack. They probably haven't, but at least they've had the benefit of knowing he's been here a few years and has been seen over a significant length of time at different levels.

 

[DHSC]

I think Sahin is suffering from not playing in his position. Give him a go in his favoured position and then ship him out end of the season if he still doesnt impress.

 

[Glen C]

Rodgers has been benching his darling MF general recently playing other MFers ahead of him. Looks to me like he's actually picking up the ones who's current form is best. I believe he really wanted it to work for Şahin. Pity that it hasn't (so far) and again, I hope we're not making a big mistake here.

Exactly. When he's dropping the player he called the Welsh xavi then you know he has no favourites. He's basically saying to the players play well and you stay in the team, just how it should be. If sahin wants to make the team then he needs to work a lot harder than he currently is. So I don't see it as a mistake at all. I wonder if sahin came here thinking he was going to be an automatic choice and wouldn't have to earn his place.

 

[Glen C]

What are you basing this on Glen? I get that he's not figured much, but from that we can surmise alot of things. Rodgers might not rate him now that he's seen him, Şahin might not like it here, he might not fit the system, he might not work hard enough, he might have been out injured too much to be deemed cost effective. Writing him off based on a handful of games and time spent out injured is lazy, as said, you're saying he lacks "heart and desire" and that he's "been here a few months and not showed much". He's scored and created about as many as most of our other players bar Suarez, in half the time. Now there might be a grain of truth to the fact that he's struggled with the physical aspect (he wasn't alone in getting brushed aside in midfield), but it takes time to settle sometimes and he's had a fairly bad injury to deal with. You're acting like he's been given more than enough playing time and that he's been available enough to make such an assessment - he hasn't, so I don't know why you're talking like we've seen enough of the lad.

It's also worth noting he hasn't played much football over the last year, so why he's getting written off so early in his career with us is beyond me, yet people still moan about Pacheco not getting a chance and that managers haven't given him a fair crack. They probably haven't, but at least they've had the benefit of knowing he's been here a few years and has been seen over a significant length of time at different levels.

Just basing on what I've seen of him so far. Yeah I know he's been out injured and stuff. But I'll see him having no problem rushing to get forward, but always seems really slow to wanna get back. He wants to do all the nice stuff but none of the gritty things for the team. That's nothing to do with fitness at all.

End of the day he's currently not in the team because he's not deemed good enough. He needs to step up his game if he wants to make it here. A midfielder who won't get stuck in for the team won't make it here.

 

[mark1975]

"currently not in the team because he's not deemed good enough" - he was on the bench for the first time ages yesterday after a lengthy injury layoff. I think you're bending the truth a bit.

 

[phantomjoy]

You guys are missing the point. Cole out 90 k. Sahin out 90k. Carroll out 80k. That's 260 k in weekly wages right there. So Sturridge 60k. Leaves 200k for.....

 

[keniget]

You guys are missing the point. Cole out 90 k. Şahin out 90k. Carroll out 80k. That's 260 k in weekly wages right there. So Sturridge 60k. Leaves 200k for.....

Reporting for duty.

 

[Glen C]

"currently not in the team because he's not deemed good enough" - he was on the bench for the first time ages yesterday after a lengthy injury layoff. I think you're bending the truth a bit.

Even before the injury he was mainly on the bench. Like I said I'm not denying his technical ability and talent, just saying he needs more grit in his game. I think Madrid loaned him out hoping he would get that here as mourinho loves a physical team. Alonso for all his amazing talent still does the dirty stuff as well. Sahin needs that in his game if you want to make it in our league.

The reason why I questioned his heart and desire is because sahin seemed like the perfect player for Rodgers. The type of player that would excel in his system and yet Rodgers doesn't use him, why? Then I remembered what he said when he bought Allen about the things he looks for in a player for them to succeed here and came to the conclusion it was his heart, desire or mentality because we know it's not his talent. Plus he just seems to go through the motions on the pitch for me.