• You may have to login or register before you can post and view our exclusive members only forums.
    To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Big Four no more

Forums Unread posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
the count

the count

SCM's least favourite muppet- There was a poll
Honorary Member
When we permanently checked out of the big four both Man City and Spurs vied for the spot for a couple of seasons but in truth City are the only one of the two capable of adding to their title haul at the moment. It looks like Arsenal have fallen out of the group as well.
Realistically there is only a "big three" at the moment and I am not even that convinced that Chelsea are at the level of the Manchester clubs, though the continuing ability to flash the cash and snap up world class talent will probably keep them there..
So who is most likely to threaten/join this group and is it possible to do so without splashing the cash to do so?
 
the count said:
When we permanently checked out of the big four both Man City and Spurs vied for the spot for a couple of seasons but in truth City are the only one of the two capable of adding to their title haul at the moment. It looks like Arsenal have fallen out of the group as well.
Realistically there is only a "big three" at the moment and I am not even that convinced that Chelsea are at the level of the Manchester clubs, though the continuing ability to flash the cash and snap up world class talent will probably keep them there..
So who is most likely to threaten/join this group and is it possible to do so without splashing the cash to do so?
Click to expand...

To be honest after the big 3 there's definitely a gap in quality. Any of newcastle, spurs, everton and arsenal can get it. If we are within 8 points of top 4 by january and get a decent striker then we'll be in with a outside chance as well. right now on current form Everton are favourites.
 
Glen C said:
To be honest after the big 3 there's definitely a gap in quality. Any of newcastle, spurs, everton and arsenal can get it. If we are within 8 points of top 4 by january and get a decent striker then we'll be in with a outside chance as well. right now on current form Everton are favourites.
Click to expand...
*Vomits*
 
Silver Sean said:
If our manager really believes 8th would be fantastic we are truly fucked.
Click to expand...
There's no point in hiding away from it - We are gonna be a bit shit this season. Finishing 8th would suck but at least it's realistic. I agree with Larry H on this really. Next season is a different matter though.
 
Silver Sean said:
If Moyes can get that shower to believe and fight and win games like he does, surely we can match them at least.
Click to expand...

In-fucking-deed.

You could list all the decent teams weve played, and point out apart from the Arsenal game we were well in it every time, but then points dont lie so.... Still IMO we should be able to better or match Everton and that isnt red on blue bitterness its fact.
 
Red Astaire said:
There's no point in hiding away from it - We are gonna be a bit shit this season. Finishing 8th would suck but at least it's realistic. I agree with Larry H on this really. Next season is a different matter though.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. But to me top 4 would be 'fantastic'.

adjective
1.
conceived or appearing as if conceived by an unrestrained imagination; odd and remarkable; bizarre; grotesque
2.
fanciful or capricious, as persons or their ideas or actions
3.
imaginary or groundless in not being based on reality; foolish or irrational
4.
extravagantly fanciful; marvelous.
5.
incredibly great or extreme; exorbitant


8th would be acceptable, just.
 
There's a big 3 - Chelsea and the Manchesters all of whom keep their big players and add more regardless every year.

The additional 2 - Arse and Tottenham, both of whom were almost creating a top 5 but sold key players and the replacements haven't met the deficit yet

The over performers - Newcastle and Everton, relatively settled, sales don't seem to have de-stabilised the teams and have fared extremely well with their signings.

Then there's us.

It's still spurs or arsenal for fourth for me for fourth, arsenal's squad depth and quality defensively is a bit shit imo but those two are still a bit ahead of everton and newcastle. It's a shame for us because there's a definite opportunity for someone to steal fourth.
 
Markeh said:
There's a big 3 - Chelsea and the Manchesters all of whom keep their big players and add more regardless every year.

The additional 2 - Arse and Tottenham, both of whom were almost creating a top 5 but sold key players and the replacements haven't met the deficit yet

The over performers - Newcastle and Everton, relatively settled, sales don't seem to have de-stabilised the teams and have fared extremely well with their signings.

Then there's us.

It's still spurs or arsenal for fourth for me for fourth, arsenal's squad depth and quality defensively is a bit shit imo but those two are still a bit ahead of everton and newcastle. It's a shame for us because there's a definite opportunity for someone to steal fourth.
Click to expand...
We are currently 8 points from 4th. We can't afford to let the gap get any bigger if we want an outside chance by the time we buy a striker in january. Wigan are in great form at the moment, and im sure Martinez will badly want to win this one, but we HAVE TO beat them its as simple as that. A draw isn't good enough. Just winning 2 games on the spin would catapult us up the league as only the top 3 seem to win two games in a row.
 
Glen C said:
We are currently 8 points from 4th. We can't afford to let the gap get any bigger if we want an outside chance by the time we buy a striker in january. Wigan are in great form at the moment, and im sure Martinez will badly want to win this one, but we HAVE TO beat them its as simple as that. A draw isn't good enough. Just winning 2 games on the spin would catapult us up the league as only the top 3 seem to win two games in a row.
Click to expand...

Do you actually have hopes of finishing in the top 4?

I'm not harbouring any hope of the top four but I have a sneaking suspicion we'll finish close enough to rue dropping points in 3 or 4 games which we should have won.
 
Markeh said:
Do you actually have hopes of finishing in the top 4?

I'm not harbouring any hope of the top four but I have a sneaking suspicion we'll finish close enough to rue dropping points in 3 or 4 games which we should have won.
Click to expand...
I don't think we will, but i'm HOPING we will. Can't help it even though everything points towards us not having a chance at 4th. Logic says no chance, but the supporter in me is still holding out. I think my hope comes from the fact that the teams above us aren't doing that well at the moment either and that if we actually had a clinical finisher to play alongside suarez and get lucas back i reckon we could put a run together.
 
Sunny said:
Get used to not being in the top four whilst FSG are in charge
Click to expand...
the standard in the league is poor IMO. Two finishers in the team and we'd make top 4. Nowhere near good enough for europe, but good enough to make it though with the finishers.
 
Glen C said:
I don't think we will, but i'm HOPING we will. Can't help it even though everything points towards us not having a chance at 4th. Logic says no chance, but the supporter in me is still holding out. I think my hope comes from the fact that the teams above us aren't doing that well at the moment either and that if we actually had a clinical finisher to play alongside suarez and get lucas back i reckon we could put a run together.
Click to expand...

Good man, I used to put on a £20 bet on us winning the league every year because of that hope but it's been lost for a few seasons. You're right about a lot of the other teams showing poor form but I just need to see something in our team to tell me we have a chance of putting a run together but I can't see it at the minute, it feels like there's more wrong than right about the side.

A few wins to put us in the top half and some exciting signings in january could give fans a lot to be optimistic about.
 
Markeh said:
Good man, I used to put on a £20 bet on us winning the league every year because of that hope but it's been lost for a few seasons. You're right about a lot of the other teams showing poor form but I just need to see something in our team to tell me we have a chance of putting a run together but I can't see it at the minute, it feels like there's more wrong than right about the side.

A few wins to put us in the top half and some exciting signings in january could give fans a lot to be optimistic about.
Click to expand...
If the other teams above us were in great form i'd have given up hope by now. But even arsenal and spurs aren't doing great and i don't see everton sustaining this form. But yeah i know what you mean. Would be nice to see a sign that we have a chance. two wins on the trot would do that ;-).
 
Glen C said:
If the other teams above us were in great form i'd have given up hope by now. But even arsenal and spurs aren't doing great and i don't see everton sustaining this form. But yeah i know what you mean. Would be nice to see a sign that we have a chance. two wins on the trot would do that ;-).
Click to expand...

If we had produced another 1 or 2 results like Norwich I'd have believed there's something more to come, but I still hope you're right, it's a great thing to still have interest in the league come spring.
 
Anyone who thinks Everton are overachieving isn't watching them this season. They comfortably beat utd, came back from conceding 2 early goals in the derby and should have won it. They have come from behind so often you could mistake them for utd. Motes has put together a superb first 11/13 players. They play great football contrary to what our 1 eyed captain would have you believe and apart from squad depth have everything they need to make top 4. Let's just hope they get alot of injuries fast.
 
Dreambeliever said:
Anyone who thinks Everton are overachieving isn't watching them this season. They comfortably beat utd, came back from conceding 2 early goals in the derby and should have won it. They have come from behind so often you could mistake them for utd. Motes has put together a superb first 11/13 players. They play great football contrary to what our 1 eyed captain would have you believe and apart from squad depth have everything they need to make top 4. Let's just hope they get alot of injuries fast.
Click to expand...

Good to see you've moved on from United.

To Everton.
 
Their whole season rests on pienaar and fellani staying fit. We need them both out and then they will drop. But if they stay fit then they'll be serious contenders for 4th.
 
Dreambeliever said:
Whats your chalkboard filled take on Everton oh all knowing one?
Click to expand...

They've had a manager who's been there for a decade, have players all coming into their prime - Fellaini, Jagielka, Jelavic, Pienaar, etc, have quite obviously targeted a strong start to the league campaign to counteract their usually shit starts, and have been playing togethor as a group for a number of years now.

There's no one silver bullet, it's just consistency is all.

If they keep everyone fit, they've got a chance of going well. but that's a big if, they're short in central midfield and central defence if one or two injuries arise - which they invariably will.

Their style is barely deserving of a chalkboard. they're the least unpredictable team in the league tactics and style wise. Their side is comprised of struicture, organisation, and 8 or 9 players doing an inglorious role - thus allowing the likes of Baines, Pienaar and Fellaini to try and engineer craft for them.

Good on them. They're exemplifying the importance of structure and consistency, something our own Liverpool side could learn a lot from.
 
Have to say, I agree with Dreamy. I think Everton are better than they're getting credit for. They look better than Newcastle and Spurs to me and, if they keep going as they are, will end up 4th or 5th.
 
Dreambeliever said:
Anyone who thinks Everton are overachieving isn't watching them this season. They comfortably beat utd, came back from conceding 2 early goals in the derby and should have won it. They have come from behind so often you could mistake them for utd. Motes has put together a superb first 11/13 players. They play great football contrary to what our 1 eyed captain would have you believe and apart from squad depth have everything they need to make top 4. Let's just hope they get alot of injuries fast.
Click to expand...

They're still overachieving though, unless they were expected to be fourth?

I don't think anyone disagrees that they're playing well and their league position isn't flattering, I still don't think it'll last the season.
 
Ryan said:
They've had a manager who's been there for a decade, have players all coming into their prime - Fellaini, Jagielka, Jelavic, Pienaar, etc, have quite obviously targeted a strong start to the league campaign to counteract their usually shit starts, and have been playing togethor as a group for a number of years now.

There's no one silver bullet, it's just consistency is all.

If they keep everyone fit, they've got a chance of going well. but that's a big if, they're short in central midfield and central defence if one or two injuries arise - which they invariably will.

Their style is barely deserving of a chalkboard. they're the least unpredictable team in the league tactics and style wise. Their side is comprised of struicture, organisation, and 8 or 9 players doing an inglorious role - thus allowing the likes of Baines, Pienaar and Fellaini to try and engineer craft for them.

Good on them. They're exemplifying the importance of structure and consistency, something our own Liverpool side could learn a lot from.
Click to expand...
You would do well to rewatch the Swansea game where they passed them off the park and turned them over relatively easily away from home to boot. Them come back and tell me they don't have style.

Also 8/9 players leaves 1 player to engineer craft as you can hardly put the keeper into that category yet you mention 3 players who can engineer craft in Baines, Pienaar and Fellaini? And what about Jelavic or Mirallas or Osman or Naismith? Are they all inglorious roles? Because the last time I looked all of those players were scoring goals/creating goals?

So which is it?

And back to my original post, in summary I said Everton were playing superbly have a great first 11 and barring injury will get 4th, and if you strip away all of your condescending b*llshit I would summarise your opinion as being identical. You really loath agreeing with me on anything 🙂
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom