A season in transition

[keniget]

That's been the theme this season and given the way things have gone in recent seasons it's hardly surprising. There probably isn't a Liverpool fan left that expects all that much from the team - not this season anyways.

And it's that last point that concerns me. To cut to the chase, I feel like we've tried to run before we could walk this season. The more I reflect on each passing game, the more it feels like we've been overly aspirational - not in terms of hoping to finish in the CL spots or winning things, but in the way we've tried to play.

I expected a manager to come in and establish a solid baseline from which we can then build on. We seem to have instead skipped straight to the fun stuff where we play like we're Barcelona. Now don't get me wrong, I love the ambition and idealism is great - particularly when it's based around that style of football - however I feel that we've suffered from a lack of pragmatism. And in a season of transition we probably really needed that.

It seems that most have been willing to give Rodgers a free pass this year on the understanding that he needs time and he inherited a dysfunctional side, however will be expecting a lot more next season.

We're now in March and people are talking about completely gutting our defence and performing major surgery in midfield. Assuming us dumb fans are right and that's what is going to happen - where does that leave us next season?

Another "season in transition"?

 

[Hansern]

Arent we talking about signing 2 CBs and one midfielder?
Thats hardly major surgery mate.
The massive risk is obviously that we have to be spot on with the signings, which is nearly impossible to predict.

As for next season. Seeing as the progression this season is that we from the start of the year only have 2 teams above us in the form table and we're scoring the most goals in the league. A season of transition is out of the question. I expect a real top 4 challenge, and that we're right up there in May.
Rodgers will be judged after those expectations.
The money spent and a season like we're having now, real progress in terms of points is expected.

 

[Fabio]

Ive no doubt we're in for a long ride before we even get close to hitting the heights of a few years ago.
Every season its a "if we just buy a Right winger, we'll be there", but now its "if we buy 2 centre backs, a left back, a defensive mid, and another striker". Its too much for rodgers to get all the signings right but he'll need to, because patience will well and truly be thin on the ground if we're as inconsistent and indifferent as we have been at certain stages this season.

Sadly, a transition doesn't occur over one season, it needs to be phased in gradually like united have done by building title winning sides after title winning sides. Next season the bulk of ur fans will turn on rodgers unless w hit the ground running, and its quite sad.

 

[Squiggles]

Rodgers stepped into a side where he thought our defense was good enough. We all did. The way they played last season was impressive and have us confidence that we would keep them for the long-term. So he's prioritised the attack, and for my money has done a very good job of reinvigorating it.

Our CB's haven't performed to the required standard. In fact they've been embarrassing at times, and, well, here we are.

The FB's are good enough. If we can find/sign a two decent CB's and get a DM in then we should see a significant improvement next season.

 

[Fabio]

Arent we talking about signing 2 CBs and one midfielder?
Thats hardly major surgery mate.
The massive risk is obviously that we have to be spot on with the signings, which is nearly impossible to predict.

Its major surgery if we're willing to drop our current ones and hope an immediate bond is struck up with the pairing we pick. Its the part of the pitch where wins can become losses, so its a very delicate and precise operation that need to be performed.

As for next season. Seeing as the progression this season is that we from the start of the year only have 2 teams above us in the form table and we're scoring the most goals in the league. A season of transition is out of the question..

But we only started scoring tons of goals since january and our form picked up dramatically. Its not going to be as easy as people are expecting. An ageing gerrard, no carra, and no long term replacement for either at the minute. They are 2 irreplacable players which rodgers has the "joy" of trying to replace. Rodgers will live and die by the signings he makes this summer, and unfortunately i don't think he'll be given the money to effectively replace them.

 

[keniget]

Arent we talking about signing 2 CBs and one midfielder?
Thats hardly major surgery mate.
The massive risk is obviously that we have to be spot on with the signings, which is nearly impossible to predict.

As for next season. Seeing as the progression this season is that we from the start of the year only have 2 teams above us in the form table and we're scoring the most goals in the league. A season of transition is out of the question. I expect a real top 4 challenge, and that we're right up there in May.
Rodgers will be judged after those expectations.
The money spent and a season like we're having now, real progress in terms of points is expected.

Well I suppose that is why I alluded to the fact us fans and Rodgers might view the work ahead in the transfer market differently. Perhaps for the best in the short-term too.

Perhaps I'm worrying for nothing, but it does seem like we'll be doing major work on the spine on the team in the summer. And if we're not then we need a couple of players already at the club (like Allen) to come back next season and be completely different, which again is a risk.

(and all of this is not taking into the consideration the very real possibility that Suarez may leave)

 

[keniget]

Rodgers stepped into a side where he thought our defense was good enough. We all did. The way they played last season was impressive and have us confidence that we would keep them for the long-term. So he's prioritised the attack, and for my money has done a very good job of reinvigorating it.

Our CB's haven't performed to the required standard. In fact they've been embarrassing at times, and, well, here we are.

The FB's are good enough. If we can find/sign a two decent CB's and get a DM in then we should see a significant improvement next season.

As Rurik or someone else pointed out, the defence has been put under undue pressure by a dysfunctional midfield all season. They are not as bad as they've been made to look this season in my opinion although they've done themselves absolutely no favours, I agree.

 

[Fabio]

Rodgers stepped into a side where he thought our defense was good enough. We all did. The way they played last season was impressive and have us confidence that we would keep them for the long-term. So he's prioritised the attack, and for my money has done a very good job of reinvigorating it.

Our CB's haven't performed to the required standard. In fact they've been embarrassing at times, and, well, here we are.

The FB's are good enough. If we can find/sign a two decent CB's and get a DM in then we should see a significant improvement next season.

We all thought the CBs were good, however I thought that they would struggle slightly more this season primarily down to the fact we would play expansive attacking football, whereas under kenny last year more often than not everyone would be back helping defend. ITs why we were fucking awful at scoring, because we didn't have the players who could get up the pitch quickly enough in a counter attack. IT was just suarez, or carroll who's mobility was worse than the titanic in its current form

When helped in numbers, our CBs are good. When asked to do the basics like intercepting or knowing when to close down, they're shocking

 

[Woland]

I reckon we need one CB coz Skrtel is playing shite and Agger isn't at this best either... but they haven't turned irrevocably shit overnight. We'd probably be better off getting a top defensive coach than start trying to replace everyone. Midfield is the main problem. One top class central midfielder might be the answer to everything.

None of Lucas, Allen, Henderson or Shelvey look good enough for a top side at the minute. I wouldn't be arsed if sold them all if we knew we were getting a couple of above average replacements.

 

[Squiggles]

I agree with those points too. Rodgers is definitely culpable for the midfield being set up incorrectly. The Lucas injury hasn't helped, but that can only explain so much.

The one positive I'd like to point out is that the progress we've seen in our attacking play is highly impressive. If we can make similarly decent signings for the defensive side of our game then we'll be getting back to being a great side again.

Getting the balance right once the players in place will take longer to master, both for the players and the manager, but this summer we should be taking massive steps to becoming the side Rodgers wants us to be.

 

[hmmmmm1]

2 things which given BR extra time. one playing kids (sterling/wisdom) secondly we have played some slick football at times this year, had we been playing Rafa/Hodgson style (tactical) footy, he would have been under a lot more pressure.

That's been the theme this season and given the way things have gone in recent seasons it's hardly surprising. There probably isn't a Liverpool fan left that expects all that much from the team - not this season anyways.

And it's that last point that concerns me. To cut to the chase, I feel like we've tried to run before we could walk this season. The more I reflect on each passing game, the more it feels like we've been overly aspirational - not in terms of hoping to finish in the CL spots or winning things, but in the way we've tried to play.

I expected a manager to come in and establish a solid baseline from which we can then build on. We seem to have instead skipped straight to the fun stuff where we play like we're Barcelona. Now don't get me wrong, I love the ambition and idealism is great - particularly when it's based around that style of football - however I feel that we've suffered from a lack of pragmatism. And in a season of transition we probably really needed that.

It seems that most have been willing to give Rodgers a free pass this year on the understanding that he needs time and he inherited a dysfunctional side, however will be expecting a lot more next season.

We're now in March and people are talking about completely gutting our defence and performing major surgery in midfield. Assuming us dumb fans are right and that's what is going to happen - where does that leave us next season?

Another "season in transition"?

 

[gkmacca]

Rodgers stepped into a side where he thought our defense was good enough. We all did. The way they played last season was impressive and have us confidence that we would keep them for the long-term. So he's prioritised the attack, and for my money has done a very good job of reinvigorating it.

I don't really see why prioritising the attack should mean the transformation of a solid defence into an amateurish and cowardly shambles. That just looks like routine bad coaching. When, for example, you get everyone in a defensive wall for a free kick spinning sideways, it's a sign that something basic has gone awry. Do the players think they can take the piss of the coaching staff? Are the coaching staff incompetent?

 

[Hansern]

Its major surgery if we're willing to drop our current ones and hope an immediate bond is struck up with the pairing we pick. Its the part of the pitch where wins can become losses, so its a very delicate and precise operation that need to be performed.



But we only started scoring tons of goals since january and our form picked up dramatically. Its not going
to be as easy as people are expecting. An ageing gerrard, no carra, and no long term replacement for either at the minute. They are 2 irreplacable players which rodgers has the "joy" of trying to replace. Rodgers will live and die by the signings he makes this summer, and unfortunately i don't think he'll be given the money to effectively replace them.

Good point Mark. I dont think it will be easy either, but the minimum we should expect is a challenge for 4th. Because thats where we are right now. I'd say we're the 6th best team in league. The next step is a challenge for 4th and then slowly build towards a title challenging side.

It wont be easy at all. But Rodgers honeymoon period will be over at the start of next season (at least from most of our fans point of view).
Replacing Carra will be the biggest transfer in years, and is a must to get right.

 

[gkmacca]

You mean replacing Carragher again.

 

[Hansern]

I don't really see why prioritising the attack should mean the transformation of a solid defence into an amateurish and cowardly shambles. That just looks like routine bad coaching. When, for example, you get everyone in a defensive wall for a free kick spinning sideways, it's a sign that something basic has gone awry. Do the players think they can take the piss of the coaching staff? Are the coaching staff incompetent?

I think its more that for the last two seasons we've defended in banks of 4 and been harder to break down.
We've now got a much more attacking minded set up and the centre backs are exposed in a different way than earlier.

The Sturridge wall thing isnt something I'd blame Rodgers for tbh. Giggs did it at Anfield a year ago and I doubt they blamed Fergie for it. Its a stupid thing to do, but it happens sometimes. I doubt it will happen again ( from Sturridge mind). I'm guessing he's been put through it when they watch the game again already.

 

[Hansern]

You mean replacing Carragher again.

Depends 🙂 He hasnt "retired" from the squad/first team before.

 

[gkmacca]

Yes, but you know he stopped being first choice (after about two years in which many fans moaned about him still being first choice). He was replaced and his replacements haven't done well enough. It's reminiscent of when Hyppia was routinely dismissed for being too slow and too old but then, after he'd left, he was suddenly remembered as good enough to start. It's not Carra who needs replacing, it's his replacements.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

I've enjoyed this season and what seems to be happening on many levels at this club. Pity about some other things.

 

[Tal]

I've enjoyed this season and what seems to be happening on many levels at this club. Pity about some other things.

Come on then, list the positives and the negatives and we can all judge you.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Come on then, list the positives and the negatives and we can all judge you.

Nah, I'm happily married.

 

[Ryan]

That's been the theme this season and given the way things have gone in recent seasons it's hardly surprising. There probably isn't a Liverpool fan left that expects all that much from the team - not this season anyways.

And it's that last point that concerns me. To cut to the chase, I feel like we've tried to run before we could walk this season. The more I reflect on each passing game, the more it feels like we've been overly aspirational - not in terms of hoping to finish in the CL spots or winning things, but in the way we've tried to play.

I expected a manager to come in and establish a solid baseline from which we can then build on. We seem to have instead skipped straight to the fun stuff where we play like we're Barcelona. Now don't get me wrong, I love the ambition and idealism is great - particularly when it's based around that style of football - however I feel that we've suffered from a lack of pragmatism. And in a season of transition we probably really needed that.

It seems that most have been willing to give Rodgers a free pass this year on the understanding that he needs time and he inherited a dysfunctional side, however will be expecting a lot more next season.

We're now in March and people are talking about completely gutting our defence and performing major surgery in midfield. Assuming us dumb fans are right and that's what is going to happen - where does that leave us next season?

Another "season in transition"?

Good post Ken.
I posted this a few weeks back re the defence and Rodgers continued failing to address it - http://sixcrazyminutes.com/index.php?threads/the-summer-of-skrtl.28864/page-2#post-890980

 

[Squiggles]

I don't really see why prioritising the attack should mean the transformation of a solid defence into an amateurish and cowardly shambles. That just looks like routine bad coaching. When, for example, you get everyone in a defensive wall for a free kick spinning sideways, it's a sign that something basic has gone awry. Do the players think they can take the piss of the coaching staff? Are the coaching staff incompetent?

I'm asking the same questions myself. The balance definitely needed tipping towards a more attack orientated set-up from the Hodgson/Kenny era, but way the defense has fallen apart is unacceptable. The coaching definitely needs looking at, but what's more imperative is leadership on the pitch. The best CB's and CM's know how to able to impose themselves not on just the match, but on their team mates. Skrtel and Agger may look the business, but it's like watching an episode of 'Faking It'. Deep down, they just don't seem to have a clue what they're doing.

 

[Gary25]

I'm asking the same questions myself. The balance definitely needed tipping towards a more attack orientated set-up from the Hodgson/Kenny era, but way the defense has fallen apart is unacceptable. The coaching definitely needs looking at, but what's more imperative is leadership on the pitch. The best CB's and CM's know how to able to impose themselves not on just the match, but on their team mates. Skrtel and Agger may look the business, but it's like watching an episode of 'Faking It'. Deep down, they just don't seem to have a clue what they're doing.

Great post.

I'm thinking Skrtel's completely disillusioned at the Club and knows he's off in the summer. It's a shame because when on form, he's a really good defender imo but i suppose if the Manager doesn't fancy him and he continues playing like he did on Saturday then it's best that he goes.

With Agger, he's a strange one. L'pool fans have long been looking for him to have an injury-free season and he finally has it but it's been litered by basic defensive mistakes and a tendancy to crumble when up against a robust striker.

It's going to be really interesting to see how Rodger's goes about sorting out the defence come the summer transfer window and into next season.